is doing wudhu in a bucket permissible or do u have to use running water?

[Nafeesa]

our hot water tap is boiling n the cold water tap is freezing so i mix the two in a bucket n do my wudhu out of there, so like i dip my feet into it n get the wet etc.

however some one mentioned to me that u have to use running water. im worried now cuz that means my namaz aint been counted.

what shall i do. is this tru?

[Kareem]

think logically. they did not have running water back in the days. making wudu from a bucket is perfectly fine.

however im not sure about dipping your feet in there. water used to wash a limb can not be used to wash something else accoding to hanafi fiqh. perhaps dipping a limb in the bucket makes all the water 'used.' im not sure about that though. just take water with you hand and pour it on your feet.

[Omar HH]

In the Maliki school if you use the water for wudu you can re-use it again even if you washed with it.

In the Shafi`i school if you use it once it becomes unusable.

Wassalam.

[Yusuf]

al-Salāmu ‘alaykum wa rahmatullāh

One of the words for a ‘tap’ in Arabic is a hanafiyyah. If it makes you think of the Hanafī madh`hab, there is a quirky story that explains why.

When taps were invented, the scholars held that wudū’ (ablution) must only be performed using still water, and that running water coming through pipes from a tap may not be used to do wudū’.

The Hanafīs then looked into the matter and ruled that it was permissible to perform wudū’ using water that came from a tap. And so to this day, the tap remains the namesake of the Hanafīs.

www.arabicgems.wordpress.com

[Mansy]

our hot water tap is boiling n the cold water tap is freezing so i mix the two in a bucket n do my wudhu out of there, so like i dip my feet into it n get the wet etc.

however some one mentioned to me that u have to use running water. im worried now cuz that means my namaz aint been counted.

what shall i do. is this tru?
Asslamaualikum sister yes in hanafi fiqh the water has to be running, you can do that by taking the water out of the bucket using a mug and pouring the water on to your limbs. The water does become used if you dip your whole foot into the bucket. Next time you should be more careful and use a mug to take the water out. As far as your previous salat then you should not worry too much this is a matter of ikhtilaf and we will give you the benefit of not knowing.

Brother Yusuf: Actually the story goes that before the ottomans came into Egypt people used to do wudu in a meeda (a round basin like a fountain, you must have seen it in syria), the malikis and shafi's did not have a problem with because their concept of maa mustamal is different. When the ottoman turks came, being hanafis they had a problem doing wudu in these meedas therefore they made some spouts coming out of the side of the basins, so that the water can flow and from there it was attributed as a thing exclusive to hanafis and later on the name became genralised to mean any taps. :p

[Yusuf]

Brother Yusuf: Actually the story goes that before the ottomans came into Egypt people used to do wudu in a meeda (a round basin like a fountain, you must have seen it in syria), the malikis and shafi's did not have a problem with because their concept of maa mustamal is different. When the ottoman turks came, being hanafis they had a problem doing wudu in these meedas therefore they made some spouts coming out of the side of the basins, so that the water can flow and from there it was attributed as a thing exclusive to hanafis and later on the name became genralised to mean any taps. :p

Jazakamullahu khairan for claryfiying Sidi, I hope you are well. :)

[Nafeesa]

ok so its ok then for me to do wudhu out of a bucket n use the same water to wash my feet etc?

[Mansy]

ok so its ok then for me to do wudhu out of a bucket n use the same water to wash my feet etc?
assalamualaikum, its ok providing that you are taking the water out of the bucket with a mug, this will be counted as running water.
wassalam

[abdushakur]

assalamualaikum, its ok providing that you are taking the water out of the bucket with a mug, this will be counted as running water.
wassalam
Respected brother, i understand that in Hanafi fiqh the water has to be running over ones limbs in order for the limb to have been deemed as being washed.
However, isn't there also a ruling in Hanafi fiqh which states that if a person was to fall into a tub of water and become submerged (rather like as in diving fully into a swimming pool), then when that person emerges he/she would also have deemed to have done wudhu?

Could you please reconcile the apparent contradiction?
[i may have got it totally wrong!]

[Nafeesa]

Respected brother, i understand that in Hanafi fiqh the water has to be running over ones limbs in order for the limb to have been deemed as being washed.
However, isn't there also a ruling in Hanafi fiqh which states that if a person was to fall into a tub of water and become submerged (rather like as in diving fully into a swimming pool), then when that person emerges he/she would also have deemed to have done wudhu?

Could you please reconcile the apparent contradiction?
[i may have got it totally wrong!]


yea exactly.

im confused because didnt the prophet muhammad saw do ghusl in a basin type thing, n wen u do ghusl u dnt have to do wudhu again seperatly because wudhu is part of doing ghusl any way aint it?

so if the prophet used to do ghusl in a basin then it wud make sense that its ok dnt u think???????

im getting more confused because ppl are saying yes its ok to do it out the bucket in the same water n some are saying no its not ok n that we have to use running water. but didnt they not have runing water then in those times????

[Mansy]

Respected brother, i understand that in Hanafi fiqh the water has to be running over ones limbs in order for the limb to have been deemed as being washed.
However, isn't there also a ruling in Hanafi fiqh which states that if a person was to fall into a tub of water and become submerged (rather like as in diving fully into a swimming pool), then when that person emerges he/she would also have deemed to have done wudhu?

Could you please reconcile the apparent contradiction?
[i may have got it totally wrong!]

Assalamualiakum brother, your question makes a lot of sense. And you are right in your observation. You have to understand the point where water becomes used in hanafi fiqh.

In hanafi fiqh the water becomes used as soon as it falls off the limbs. So for example if someones submerges himself in water (say bath tub) his being in the water would not make the water used. The water will become used as soon as he comes out of the tub. After that he will not be able to use the same water again.

The sister asked about doing wudu from a bucket, to compare this to that of a swimming pool is wrong, because the laws are different for large bodies of water (like a swimming pool) and small bodies of water (like in a bucket) see my notes on water and ghusl
http://www.islam4everyone.org.uk/Downloads.html

[Mansy]

yea exactly.

im confused because didnt the prophet muhammad saw do ghusl in a basin type thing, n wen u do ghusl u dnt have to do wudhu again seperatly because wudhu is part of doing ghusl any way aint it?

Assalamualaikum sister i'm sorry if i have caused any confusion. Let me answer this part of the question and we'll move on. Your observation is right. Once you have done a full islamic ghusl (meaning you carried out the 3 fards) then you are in a state of purity and you do not need to to wudu again, in fact it is according to some ulama makruh to do the wudu straight after ghusl without a valid reason.



im getting more confused because ppl are saying yes its ok to do it out the bucket in the same water n some are saying no its not ok n that we have to use running water. but didnt they not have runing water then in those times????

Sister lets start from the begining.
If you have a small amount of water (such as in a normal sized bucket) then the water has to be running if you want to do wudu. What i mean by this is that you can't just enter you right arm in to the bucket and take it out again and then enter your left arm and take it out again and then use the same water to do masah of your head and wash your face and feet etc. The reason being the moment you take your limb (say right arm) out of the water (the water being so less) immediately turns to used water.

Therefore the water has to be running. What i mean by this is that after mixing the hot an cold water in the bucket, you should use a mug or a small bowl to take the water out from the bucket and pour that water that is in the mug over your limbs. You should be careful that this water that comes of your limbs does not fall in the bucket. Its nor neccassary that you have to have a tap for the water to be running, pouring the water over your limbs is counted as running water.

in your case i see that you mentioed that you dip your feet in to the water


so like i dip my feet into it n get the wet etc.

If you were to use a mug to take the water out of the bucket and pour the water over your limbs, and the last action that you do is dip your feet at the same time in the remaining water in the bucket then it is ok, the water in the bucket will only be used after you take your feet out. However, if you enter you right foot in to the bucket and then take your foot out, the remaining water in the bucket will be rendered used and you will not be able to use that same water to wash you left foot.

Just one more thing that needs to be addressed. A question might arise here that when you take the water out of the bucket using a mug, in that instance if your hand touches the water in the bucket would it make the water used? the answer is no the water will not be turned into used water. I'll leave it at that, if you want to know the logic behind this then please ask.

hope that answers your question.

you might want to look at my notes on tahara
http://www.islam4everyone.org.uk/Downloads.html

wassalam
Mansur

[hope_n_fear]

I'll leave it at that, if you want to know the logic behind this then please ask.

:salam:

Yes bro, I would like to know. :jazak:

:ws:

[Nafeesa]

:salam:

Yes bro, I would like to know. :jazak:

:ws:
yea same here

[Mansy]

yea same here
Assalam just give me until tomorrow, i'm a bit busy at the moment, but have i answered your question?

wassalam

[Mansy]

yea same here
Assalamualaikum, the logic behind this is quite subtle to understand. It all revolves around your intention. When we do wudu our sins fall off our limbs.

The reason why in this case the water will not be rendered in to used water is because when you use a mug to take the water, your touching the water at that time is not because you are touching it to do wudu, rather you are touching it so that you can take it out with a mug (therefore at this particular time the sins do not fall off the limbs and contaminate the water). Does that make any sense to you?

let me give you another example to explain this better.
When a person is already in the state of wudu, and he wants to do wudu again. If his intention for doing the second wudu is an act of ibada then that will contaminate the water and turn it in to used water. However, if his intention is not for ibada but he does wudu just to cool himself down, in this case although his wudu will be done but this will not make the water in to used. It all revolves around intention. I know its a bit confusing its kind of philosophical but hope that answers it :D
wassalam
mansur

[hope_n_fear]

:salam:

JazakAllah khair bro. Very interesting.

:ws:

[Nafeesa]

jizakallah bro for taking the time to answer but im still confused because some ppl say its ok n that its actually better to do it that way n some say its gotta be running etc.

its stressss

[Mansy]

jizakallah bro for taking the time to answer but im still confused because some ppl say its ok n that its actually better to do it that way n some say its gotta be running etc.

its stressss
Assalamualalikum sister i understand your concern but like i mentioned before running can also mean pouring water onto your limbs, because when you pour water it runs off your limbs, and this is how they used to do it in the prophet's (peace and blessing on him) time, they did not have taps!!!
wassalam

[TDR]

:salam:

:jazak: Mansy. This thread was very beneficial for me.

:ws:

[Abu Qatadah]

The reason why in this case the water will not be rendered in to used water is because when you use a mug to take the water, your touching the water at that time is not because you are touching it to do wudu, rather you are touching it so that you can take it out with a mug (therefore at this particular time the sins do not fall off the limbs and contaminate the water). Does that make any sense to you?

mansur

Assalamu aleykum my respected brother. I have a little question about this topic.
If you have a bouqet with water do you have to use a mug to get the water out? Cant you use your hands to fill the water in your hands?

[abidmahmood18]

Assalamualalikum sister i understand your concern but like i mentioned before running can also mean pouring water onto your limbs, because when you pour water it runs off your limbs, and this is how they used to do it in the prophet's (peace and blessing on him) time, they did not have taps!!!
wassalam

Masha'Allah, the answer is very good

Keep it up ya ustadhi

[TDR]

Assalamu aleykum my respected brother. I have a little question about this topic.
If you have a bouqet with water do you have to use a mug to get the water out? Cant you use your hands to fill the water in your hands?
Oh yeah I had this question as well. I think the answer is related to this:

...The reason why in this case the water will not be rendered in to used water is because when you use a mug to take the water, your touching the water at that time is not because you are touching it to do wudu, rather you are touching it so that you can take it out with a mug (therefore at this particular time the sins do not fall off the limbs and contaminate the water). Does that make any sense to you?...
So I'm thinking that when you cup your hands and put them in to bring out water to wash your face, arms or masah of your head, your intention is not to wash your hands but rather to bring water out. Thus the water in the bucket doesn't become used on contact in this instance.

Could somebody confirm if this is correct please?

[Ansari]

So I'm thinking that when you cup your hands and put them in to bring out water to wash your face, arms or masah of your head, your intention is not to wash your hands but rather to bring water out. Thus the water in the bucket doesn't become used on contact in this instance.

I was wondering that too after reading this thread. I thought it was fine to use your hands to take water from the bucket for wudu. (through putting your hands IN the bucket of water)

[hayya]

In hanafi fiqh the water becomes used as soon as it falls off the limbs. So for example if someones submerges himself in water (say bath tub) his being in the water would not make the water used. The water will become used as soon as he comes out of the tub. After that he will not be able to use the same water again.


What if one is submerged in the water fully, but comes out half way and then submerges back in? :confused: