opinions

[tamiki]

.

[Sadiq]

I think, this is a relevant thread;

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=879&

Why don't we follow the good example of the earlier
Muslim generation?

One would perform the Fajr prayers with the Prophet
(sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam) then join a study
circle which would go on till sun rise and then
proceed to earn his living. Later on in the day you
would find him hosting a Bedouin to teach him the
fundamentals of Islam and should there be a call for
Jihad you would find him in the forefront.

All of this constitutes Islam. All of this constitutes
Deen (a complete way of life) and there is no call to
separate those issues as all of them are divine
injunctions and requirements.

There needs to be a balance. One must always have the intention, plus relevant action too, meaning, going to the gym, getting fit. There is no seperation of, studying the deen is sooo important, or going to jihad is sooo important, both are great states to be in. As from the video of shaykh faraz rabbani, he said, we learn in order to know the means to please Allah, in order for our worship to be better. He gave the example of things 'disliked in salat', we shouldnt think, they are something we avoid, and thats it, their is greater understanding of why it is disliked.

How can we do anything without having knowledge of it? I want to pray nafl, example, the brother is a hanafi, so he will say, im not doing anything wrong, 'i am doing good, i am pleasing Allah' if i pray 'between asr and maghrib', but the ones who are aware of that time to be makruh, are those that have that certain knowledge. How valuable is knowledge then?

Emotions, eagerness we all have, but without knowledge, and sound knowledge we will not attain anything. As they say, the only way to increase your Love for Allah, is to 'know' Him...

By default we all should be 'students' of knowledge and prepare ourselves by physical training and soul training too. I give this example to people who 'just want to go', how will we feel if one finger was taken off, or one leg, yes, its part of jihad, but.. have we got the mental, emotional, heart, spiritual strength to deal with that.

When our hearts are not in need of nothing but Him, and we fear none but Him, our legs, bombs, anything will not stop us. Badr, had people who did not care nor fear. Our hearts need fixing and then we will automatically go as men of Allah.

As ulama say, those who stay in wudu all the time are the real mujahids, {do we do that?}

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

without casting aside the merits of jihad - which are indeed some of the greatest, i have always heard my teachers state that one should be concerned with the affairs of oneself primarliy, and then those muslims close to home.

i know many of you would disagree with me, but going for jihad probably won't change much. jihad is all or nothing. we either have one unified ummah which coordinates all its efforts, with major stretegic thinking and planning, or we have endless bloodshed with no gains.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

why must you look at the perceived wordly benefit of an action when we already know of the major *real* benefits of the action.

Indeed, but i believe jihad is a means, not an end. therefore, the purpose of jihad is raise the word of Allah through dawah and make His deen supreme - in the world.


are you willing to make that statement to a muslim widow or an orphan? are you willing to make that statement to a community who has there life threatened? who has the honor of their women tarnished? are you willing to make that statement to muslims who are being persecuted because of their submission to Allah?

of course not. like i said, the muslims in that area have a responsiblity to their fellow muslims.

shaykh abdal-hakim murad spoke to such people, widows, orphans, communities in palestine - and asked them what they wanted from british muslims - not one of them said come and fight to defend our homeland.


who will defend them right now?

they have the right to defend themselves. if their efforts are disoraganised, then what use are a handful of muslims from the uk?

(btw, i am not saying that going to join an armed struggle is wrong - all i am saying is we have to look the global picture, the aims, the consequences etc)


okay, so if you want to talk about benefit...what will a layman like myself do if our scholars and more influential muslims disagree with each other, refuse to cooperate with each other on the points they do agree on, seem insincere at times, make all the effort to disprove everyone else but make no effort to come together and work come up with a unified plan for change to have "one unified ummah which coordinates all its efforts,with major strategis thinking and planning"

firslty work to rectify our condition, and lets agree on the basics. if our ulama refuse to cooperate, then we are doomed as a community. Allah does not change the condition of a people until they change themselvses.


what is the problem with learning about islam and teaching the people around you as much as you know and can, while you prepare your body and soul for jihad. once you are prepared and have done your utmost to teach what you know to your community, and then ship yourself off.

There is no limit to learning. ask any scholar. how do set yourself a limit?

but i see no problem with your suggestion. i never said i had a problem with it, and i wouldn't condemn anyone for it.

[salahuddin]

:salam:

How can we hope to have success in jihad without first having had purification from our nafs? Surely this leads to the nafs wanting jihad for the wrong reasons?

On the eve of the battle for al-Quds, the great leader and commander Salah-ud-Din Al-Ayyubi walked through his ranks of troops in preparation for the next day. He came across a group of men that were sleeping and passed them by, he then came across another group who were all standing for tahajjud prayer, he looked at them and remarked "This is where victory comes from!"

:ws:

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

firstly, defence of the one's deen, life and honour and property is a right, and only becomes an obligation with conditions.

secondly, i am not entirely convinced that jihad is fard al-ayn upon me right now. aside from my reasoning, it would make every muslim male and female in the world sinful, and i doubt that very much.


also, their efforts being organized or disorganized have no bearing on the victory the Allah may or may not grant them.

i think it does. who is the amir of jihad in philistine? the argument of no amir in defensive jihad doesn't stand, because that is only when there is surprise attack.


look, my point is - we don't think of the global picture, aims and consequences without detaching them from Allah. we don't do our analysis like the non-muslim thinkers and planners.

why detach them? looking at the consequences of one's actions, strategy and planning is from the deen.


Believe me, if more Muslims had the iman to speak a word of truth to a tyrant ruler or to sacrifice their comfortable standard of living to go defend other muslims, there would be a better state of affairs.

dont mind if i analyse this statement of yours - i need to understand what you are saying.

1. 'more muslims' - is this quantitative? if 1000 more muslims spoke out, there would be a better state of affairs? if 1000 more muslims went out to iraq or palestine - there would be a better state of affairs?

2. how can i believe you when thousands upon thousands of people HAVE been doing this, and i see no better state of affairs? we must be doing something wrong????

even a whole population speaking out against a ruler has almost NO effect these days - just more people going into prison. the recent events in Egypt show that.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

if your wife is being raped, there is no obligation on your to defend it?
if your life is threatened, there is no obligation on you to defend it?

please explain what you mean, cause i had never learned it that way. i could be wrong.

we are talking about self-defense, not jihad, and so if a group of people come to you now and say "give us your money or we will kick the living **** out of you/stab you to death" - it is NOT obligatory on you to defend yourself. it becomes obligatory if you think that they may do that anyway.


i never ever said that. where are you coming up with this?

wrt to jihad - you stated it was obligatory.

the problem is today, the muslim lands are occupied and not one single muslim nation is coming to their aid. no indiviudal, group or party can call on others to jihad without this. if the rulers aint doing it, we have to change our rulers - how do we do that? well, thats another thread.

when we say that jihad becomes fard al-ayn in a concentric fashion, i was taught that the responsiblity still lies with the authority. i.e. the surrounding rulers draft together and conscipt soldiers to go abroad and ward off the enemy. as for individuals, this is not the way. who are you acting under? which amir?

secondly, as a muslim ummah, we don't have an army that is self-sufficient. all our weapons are made by our enemies - subhanallah!!! doesn't that further show you the state of affairs???


helping with the defensive jihad is an easy path to Allah's pleasure. it is easier for the layman to look at the consequences of his actions and plan and implement strategy.

I never disagreed with this per se.


but there is no confusion about participating in jihad - even if it is not obligatory on you, you still get the great rewards and earn Allah's pleasure :insh:

yes, but only if you are operating under a legitimate authority.


i am disgusted still by this last statement of yours.

first, like i explained above, it wasn't a literal statement.

second, you absolutely MUST stop looking at the issue by linking our actions to a specific result.

you must believe that our actions do not bring about specific results, Allah brings about the result.

of course we plan and make the best course of action - but we never attribute our victory to any planning that we do.

I seem to be disgusting you a lot. sorry. but victory is only from Allah. and Allah helps those who are close to him.


when the muslims were entering makkah, and surah nasr was revealed, the prophet rode on his camel with his head down.



إِذَا جَآء نَصْرُ اللَّهِ وَالْفَتْحُ-

( When there comes the help of Allah and the Victory.)

remind yourself that nothing you do is of any consequence without the help of Allah

our job is just to make the best halaal plan and execute it and rely on Allah.

EXACTLY!!!


akhi, it would be better for the muslims if we all had the taqwa, iman and didn't have the love for this dunya to all say, you know waht, i don't care if the egyptian government puts me in jail.

the point i am making is that there are deep-seated problems, not just occupation. we need to address all of those.


this is like a someone during the prophet's time saying, "no, no, no, we can't go to fight at badr! what good will it do?"

are you kidding? they only have 2 horses! but Allah sent 3,000 angels.

yes, indeed, Allah helped them. a group of united muslims under one banner - the banner of islam, following one man with pure intentions. our movements today are nothing in comparison.

as for salahuddin al-ayyubi - yes, he was in comparison.

as for emir abdal qadir al-jaza'iri - yes he was too.

There are myriads of success stories, not just Badr. although by using Badr, muslims show that numbers don't matter. it is iman and sabr. you win some you lose others. ultimately islam prevails by the permission of Allah. and only in recent times, that is not the case - WHY????

true, but there is still fiqh - and fiqh states that if the enemy outnumber you, it is permitted to flee. some from the maliki school also included military strength (e.g. weapons etc) in that.

with every succeeding group there are similarities. yes, Allah gives them success, that is clear. yet we also have to learn from history.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

bro, i think we can agree on most things...

your point about chechnya and kashmir... if there are amirs and resistance movements yes there is jihad. my point was, people flooding in from neighbouring countries - people think THIS is fard - i don't. you need authority for that.

and yes, there was jihad in afghanistan - again, a coordinated unified effort. the sad thing is look what happened as soon as Allah gave the mujahidun victory over the communists (with the help of america) - in-fighting and more sectarianism and tribalism i.e. the real state of affairs. and so tribulation befalls the nation again.


if muslim property or life is being threatened, you do not need a "legitamate authority" to organize an effort to defend it.

your statement somewhat contradicts. who will then 'organise an effort to defend it'? self-defense (which is clearly the example you have given) is not the same as jihad fisabilillah.


so the layman has two choices. his first choice is to sit on the sidelines and watch the scholars and leaders of the muslims work day and night to go back and forth on whether sisters in the west have rukhsa to not wear niqaab *or* he can say choose a path in which he can die shaheed!

NO.

the laymen has more choices than that:

1. he can 'sit on the sidelines' as you say, inviting people to Allah, living as a muslim in a non-muslim land, as there is no other justification for doing so. he can financially assist his fellow muslims abroad; he can verbally speak the truth against oppression and injustice - in front of the tyrannical ruler and still be a mujahid in the eyes of Allah.

2. he can go and learn the deen, teach it and spread it. he can become of these scholars.

3. he can make du'a for the plight of the muslims all over the globe!! - how many of us even do that??!!

4. he can go abroad and choose the path of jihad fisabilillah - and may Allah reward him for that, and let him realise that if it is not obligatory on him, he should be aware that he could be leaving behind family, children etc, an intelligent mind that can bring others to islam.

i long for the day for another salahuddin al-ayyubi, whom all the muslims will pledge their allegiance to, who will amass an army of soldiers of Allah, and who live up to the morals and chivalrous standards of our predecessors, who will unite us under the banner of islam. i will run to him inshallah.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

is it recommended to make intention to study the deen and prepare your nafs and then to go to jihad somewhere in the world, given the great benefits of jihad?

It is certainly recommended to make the intention to fight jihad, as the authentic hadith states. as for whether is it legally mandub - Allah knows best.


what about making this intention to go with or without the permission of your mother?

can you go without their permission?


what about making this intention to go when your mother passes away or late in your own life?

If there was offensive jihad today - making this intention would definitely be recommended. late in your own life - would you go if you had a wife and children who had no dependents and no income (as we know no muslim authorities support the families of mujahidun)?



what are the opinions of knowledgable people about this?

sorry i am far from knowledgable. but i just wanted to contribute to your interesting questions. hope you don't mind

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

well said.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

some interesting issues raised in this talk by habib ali al-jifri :

http://www.radicalmiddleway.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=57&Itemid=45

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

you right, we agree on just about everything.

i'm an idiot cause it took me the 103,243 posts in the thread to figure it out.

...i think i also may have misunderstood what you were trying to say.


can you say that an "organised effort to defend it" is when the people and mujahideen of an area appoint an amir - since the prophet said to appoint an amir if in a group of three or more?

YES.

but it gets rather complicated when you have HAMAS vs. Fatah; Lashkar-e-Toiba vs. Hizb al-Mujahideen; etc etc.... if we can't have a united resistance, its rather sad.


this was a fun discussion, forgive me if i upset you or harmed you in any way.

assalamu alaikum

wa alaykum as-salam ;)