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Mysticwoman
20-10-2004, 06:01 PM
SAlam'Aleykum

There are people who say Nikaab (veil) is obligatory on sisters , whereas sum others say it aint really necessary its optional .. I would like to hear what you all have to say.

JazakAllahu Khairan

eat-halal guy
20-10-2004, 06:21 PM
:salam:


In the Hanafi school, the face, hands, and feet are not awrah. However, the recorded position since the earliest times is that it is necessary (wajib) to cover the face for other than old women, because of the fitna. It is still possible to implement this ruling in the Muslim world. We see, for example, Shaykh Wahbi Sulayman Ghawji, a major Albanian Hanafi alim of great knowledge, wisdom, and taqwa, who lived a long time in Syria and is an author of countless useful works, authoring numerous works reinforcing the necessity (wujub) of niqab according to the vast majority of the jurists of Islam, and criticizing modernists and some Salamis (such as Nasir al-Albani) for saying it is not recommended.

HOWEVER , this is very hard to implement in the West. As such, Mufti Mahmoud’s answer, echoed by many other god-fearing scholars who know about the West, can be safely acted upon. Anyone who can, in his or her circumstances, wear niqab, without fear of harm or trouble, is undoubtedly doing that which is best.


http://www.sunnipath.com/resources/Questions/qa00001329.aspx

faqir
20-10-2004, 06:32 PM
Asalamu alaykum,

I have never understood this ruling that it is wajib to cover the face if there is fear of fitna - what is the exact definition of fitna in this context - it seems rather subjective....

Muawiyah
20-10-2004, 07:39 PM
In Tafseer of what Allah Ta'ala say in surat ul-Ahzaab ayah 59:



يا أيها النبي قل لأزواجك وبناتك ونساء المؤمنين يدنين عليهن من جلابيبهن ذلك أدنى أن يعرفن فلا يؤذين وكان الله غفورا رحيما {سورة الأحزاب آية ٥٩}


the Mufassir ul Quraan Ibn `Abbaas Radhi Allaahu `anhu says:



ذلك أن تلويه المرأة حتى لا يظهر منها إلا عين واحدة تبصر بها


i.e that the woman covers herself except one eye with which she sees

al-Jaami' li Ahkaam il-Quraan - Soorat ul-Ahzaab (http://www.al-eman.com/Islamlib/viewchp.asp?BID=136&CID=179)

{not a shia site despite the spelling}

UmmIbrahimIsa
20-10-2004, 10:14 PM
Asalamu alaykum,

I have never understood this ruling that it is wajib to cover the face if there is fear of fitna - what is the exact definition of fitna in this context - it seems rather subjective....


assalamu alaikum wr wb

in case her beauty stops traffic and causes a jam is what is meant by her face of fear of fitnah.

There are some that are known for that where if they walk by, ppl get distracted from their work and just glare, stare at her while walking so they end up walking into a pole. (ex archie comics, melody character) so her covering her face is necessary to protect her from trouble of these ppl that should be lowering their gaze in the 1st place... but since they cant or dont remember what that word means this is just a means of protection and precaution of safety.

Allahu Alim

Allahu Alim.

VeiledOne
21-10-2004, 01:49 AM
Asalaamualaikum,
Below is an excellent article. Please read.


Is Nikab Necessary?


Q: Is it necessary for a woman to cover her face in the presence of strangers (who are not her designated Mahaarim) according to Shariáh?




This question is answered in this article in the context of the claim that the veil or Niqaab is primarily 'a social requirement and custom according to the environment and custom and according to the environment and customs of a particular country.' In endeavouring to answer the question, we will confine ourselves to a brief examination of the relevant Qurãnic verses.

Surah An-Nur, Verses 30 and 31

And Say to the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent (like both eyes for necessity to see the way, or outer palms of hands or one eye or dress like veil, gloves, head-cover, apron), and to draw their veils all over Juyubihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bossoms) and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband's fathers, or their sons, or their husband's sons, or their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim women) (i.e. sisters in Islam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of feminine sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful.
It is apparent that upon a plain reading the purpose of the verse is to eradicate promiscuity, fornication and adultery and all the preliminary steps that lead directly to the commission of such shameful acts. The references to 'lowering their gaze', 'drawing their veils over their bosoms' and 'striking their feet to draw attention' indicate that all acts or omissions which, in the ordinary course leads directly to sexual promiscuity and FITNAH are forbidden.

In order to totally eradicate sexual promiscuity and FITNAH, the verse goes on to say that a woman is not permitted to display her beauty and charms except in degrees to her husband, father and the other classes of person specified in the verse. The exempt class would constitute the MAHAARIM, and any other would qualify as strangers or GHAIR MAHRAM. The principle fixed by the verse is, therefore, that a woman cannot display her beauty to any male person other than the persons exempted by the verse. It goes without saying that the face is the focal-point of a woman's beauty, and the main source of attraction. Hence, the face of a woman cannot be displayed or shown to a stranger in normal circumstances whether in public or private according to the general principle fixed by the verse as stated above. She is permitted to display her beauty to the exempt class (the MAHAARIM) for obvious reasons of close contact, and because of the considerably lesser danger of sexual promiscuity and FITNAH within that class. (Zamakhshari)

The Shariáh, however, is practical, dynamic and takes into account the real situations of life. A woman may - in the case of genuine need - be forced to expose her face in the presence of strangers. For example, when she appears in court to give witness, etc.

It is against this background that the preceding portion of the verse 'they should not display their beauty and charms except what must ordinarily appear unavoidable' falls into proper perspective. The words 'Illaa maa dhahara min'haa' are in context an exception to the general rule, and cover those cases of genuine need and necessity when a woman is forced to expose her face in the presence of a stranger. That is how the great commentators of the Noble Qurãn have interpreted the verse.

Take the following two examples:

"Women must not display any part of their beauty and charms to strangers except what cannot possibly be concealed." (Ibn Katheer)
"Why is the woman permitted to display her external beauty and charms? Because to conceal that would cause her inconvenience. A woman is forced to deal in commodities with her own hands. She is compelled by genuine need to expose her face especially at the times of giving evidence, litigating in court and marriage. She is compelled to walk the streets and expose her feet, especially poor women. This is the meaning of 'illaa maa dhahara min' haa' that is 'except what the situations of ordinary life compel her to expose." (Zamakhshari)

A further point is the interpretation of 'illaa maa dhahara min'haa' has been highlighted by the well known scholar, Moulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi (RA). He states that the verb used is that of the first form 'dhahara' and not 'adhhar' which (in fourth form) signifies a deliberate exposure or display. The use of 'maa dhahara' indicates that the exposure of the face is confined to need. (Imdaadul Fataawa vol. 4 p. 181)

It follows from the aforegoing that upon a proper interpretation of the verse the face and hands of a woman can only be exposed to strangers in a situation of genuine need where concealment would cause her serious inconvinience. However, genuine need is not open to wide interpretations.

SURA AL-AHZAAB - VERSE 53

And when you ask them for anything you want, ask them from behind a screen.
The meaning of this verse is clear: the companions of the Holy Prophet (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) were ordered to communicate with the wives of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) from behind a screen and not directly face to face. It is obvious that this instruction is not limited to the wives of the Holy Prophet (Sallallaau Álayhi Wasallam). The verse has general application and the fact that the noble wives of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) are specifically mentioned emphasises the importance of the subject matter. The distinguished jurist, Abubakar Jassas (RA) in his Ahkaamul Qurãn states:

"This order, although revealed specifically in relation to the Holy Prophet (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) is general in application because we are ordered to follow him."
Similarly, the well known commentator of the Noble Qurãn Imaam Qurtubi (RA) in his Al-Jamia li Ahkaamul Qurãn states:

"All women are in effect covered by the terms of the verse which embraces the Sharée principle that the whole of a woman is 'Áwrah' (to be concealed) - her body and voice, as mentioned previously. It is not permissible to expose those parts except in the case of need, such as the giving of evidence."
SURAH AL-AHZAAB - VERSE 59

O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) all over their bodies (i.e. screen themselves completely except the eyes or one eye to see the way).
In his commentary to this verse, Allama Abubakar Jassas (RA) states the following:

"This verse proves that a young woman is ordered to cover her face from strangers, and to manifest SATR and modesty in public so that doubtful people may not be desirous of her."
It is sufficient to quote the following authentic commentators in their interpretation of the verse:

"They (women), shall cover their faces and bodies with their outer garment when they appear in public for a valid reason."
[They shall cover their faces and...]

Ibn Ábbaas states that the Muslim women are ordered to cover their head and faces with outer garments except for one eye.

And Allah Taãla Knows Best.

Mufti Ebrahim Desai, www.ask-imam.com
FATWA DEPT.

faqir
21-10-2004, 09:20 AM
Asalamu alaykum,

As far as I know, the Niqab is not considered awrah according to the four Imams (although there is apparently another narration from Imam Ahmad that suggests otherwise).

I think what the Ulema from the madhahib have said, however, is that the Niqab becomes wajib if there is fear of fitnah. Have the ulema defined fitnah in this context?

I remember Sh. Abdallah bin Bayyah mentioning in one of his talks in the Legal Philosophy of Islam a narration from Rasul Allah salallahu alayhi wasalam's last pilgrimage where a young woman came to ask the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam a question and one of the sahaba sitting next to him started staring at her at which point he salallahu alayhi wasalam pushed his face to the side [as opposed to telling the woman to cover her face]. Has anyone come across this hadith?

see also: http://www.sunnipath.com/resources/Questions/qa00003149.aspx

Note: I totally agree that wearing Niqab is an excellent practice for the sisters.

Yaseen
21-10-2004, 10:43 AM
salaams

A lot of Muslim women do not even understand the true meaning and requirements of the hijaab let alone understand the importance of niqaab. In the sub-con a lot of women think that merely a piece of cloth is sufficient. Often the piece of cloth,referred to as a dupatta, is see through thus defeating the object of the excercise. Also there is no effort made to cover all the hair as most of the hair is clearly visible.

In the Hindu culture the dupatta is sufficient for Hindu women as regards covering the head. So in reality the dupatta meets the Hindu requirements of the headscarf rather than the shar'i requirements.

Would somebody be able to provide with some info as to where it is commanded for a woman to cover all her hair. The reason being that it is very difficult to convince those members of my family who hold the view that the dupatta is sufficient in fulfilling the requirements of hijaab. I find it difficult in convincing them as I cannot point towards a particular reference. Any help would be appreciated.

Wasalaam

Mossy
21-10-2004, 12:33 PM
I disagree with those that come to the conclusion that niqaab is mandatory.

Possibly even with those that come to the conclusion it's recommended due to the societal impact of wearing it (which must be a consideration, we do not live in a vacuum).

I found some of the articles here: http://www.muhajabah.com/articles.htm of interest when having a quick scan across the topic.

Muawiyah
21-10-2004, 04:28 PM
رسالة الحجاب - شيخ محمد الصالح بن العثيمين (http://www.al-eman.com/Islamlib/viewchp.asp?BID=314&CID=1)

GenN
22-10-2004, 11:30 AM
Assalmu alaykum,

well, wajib or not lets get one thing straight. most of the people across the globe these days, due to influence of western culture, when they see a woman the first thing that automatically comes into their heads, the first thing they think of whether concisouly or sub-concisouly is "she is good looking/or not".

So if you don't mind other people constantly "checking out" your wives then sure go ahead no need for em to wear niqaab. But anyone with a bit of shame would get em to wear niqaab.

Abul Hasan
22-10-2004, 11:40 AM
[QUOTE=faqir]Asalamu alaykum,

As far as I know, the Niqab is not considered awrah according to the four Imams (although there is apparently another narration from Imam Ahmad that suggests otherwise).

I think what the Ulema from the madhahib have said, however, is that the Niqab becomes wajib if there is fear of fitnah. Have the ulema defined fitnah in this context?

I remember Sh. Abdallah bin Bayyah mentioning in one of his talks in the Legal Philosophy of Islam a narration from Rasul Allah salallahu alayhi wasalam's last pilgrimage where a young woman came to ask the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam a question and one of the sahaba sitting next to him started staring at her at which point he salallahu alayhi wasalam pushed his face to the side [as opposed to telling the woman to cover her face]. Has anyone come across this hadith?

:salam:

Here is the narration as found in Sahih al-Bukhari (2:589)

Narrated `Abdullah bin `Abbas :

Al-Fadl (his brother) was riding behind Allah's Apostle (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) and a woman from the tribe of Khath'am came and Al-Fadl started looking at her and she started looking at him. The Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) turned Al-Fadl's face to the other side. The woman said, "O Allah's Apostle! The obligation of Hajj enjoined by Allah on His devotees has become due on my father and he is old and weak, and he cannot sit firm on the Mount; may I perform Hajj on his behalf?" The Prophet replied, "Yes, you may." That happened during the Hajj-al-Wida (of the Prophet ).


-----------------------------------------

Na'am in places of Fitna to wear the Niqab is better, Ulama have said it is Wajib.

auron
22-10-2004, 11:47 AM
all these posts have been answered by the last post in"women wearing noisy slippers thread"please someone paste it here quick.

Omar_Farouk
22-10-2004, 01:50 PM
http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1591

:D

auron
22-10-2004, 01:52 PM
peace

Omar_Farouk
22-10-2004, 02:01 PM
:cheesygri

Mysticwoman
22-10-2004, 02:05 PM
JazaKAllahu Khairan for the posts.. it helped me clear my mind.. so coming to the conclusion .. living in todays society ... i guess Niqaab is waajib .. since theres too much fitnah outside....

Mossy
22-10-2004, 04:48 PM
No.. Some say it's wajib and others don't.. Fitnah means more than temptation - you should also weigh up reactions to wearing a face veil in a society such as those present in the West - it has negative results as well as positive.