Shaikh Nuh Ha Mim Keller

[Salah ud Deen]

Nuh Ha Mim Keller, American Muslim translator and specialist in Islamic Law. Born in 1954 in the north-western United States,was educated in philosophy and Arabic at the University of Chicago and UCLA. He entered Islam in 1977 at al-Azhar in Cairo, and later studied the traditional Islamic Sciences of hadith, Shafi'i and Hanafi jurisprudence, legal methodology (usul al-fiqh), and tenets of faith (`aqidah) in Syria and Jordan, where he has lived since 1980. His English translation of `Umdat al-Salik [The Reliance of the Traveller] (1250 pp., Sunna Books, 1991) is the first Islamic legal work in a European language to receive the certification of al-Azhar, the Muslim world's oldest institution of higher learning. He also possesses ijazas or "certifiates of authorisation" in Islamic jurisprudence from sheikhs in Syria and Jordan.
His Other translations and works include: Al-Maqasid: Imam Nawawi's Manual of Islam; The Sunni Path: A Handbook of Islamic Belief; and Tariqa Notes (handbook for those on the Shadhilli path of tasawwuf). He is currently translating Imam Nawawi's Kitab al-Adhkar [The Book of Rememberance of Allah], a compendium of some 1227 hadiths on prayers and dhikrs of the prophetic sunna. He is also completing a work on the issue of the Qibla which will be available soon.
Some Audio Durus [lessons] are available on the VA Suhba website.

www.suhba.org

http://www.masud.co.uk/ISLAM/nuh/default.htm

[ahsanirfan]

I see another admirer of the Sheikh! Welcome to the forum akhi!

[Salah ud Deen]

I see another admirer of the Sheikh! Welcome to the forum akhi!
He is my murshed. I have much respect for him and have been to a few Suhba's to learn from him.

[ahsanirfan]

He is my murshed. I have much respect for him and have been to a few Suhba's to learn from him.

He is my murshid too! Subhan Allah! I haven't been to any Suhba's yet, though a Canadian Suhba is somewhere in the works, inshaAllah.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

as salamu alaykum

he is not my murshid - but i love this shaykh so much. he has so much presence - inshaAllah may we all benefit from him....

[ahsanirfan]

^insha Allah

[ilm_seeker]

As sallamu alaikum

I don't have a Murshid, but after listening to the lectures on www.suhba.com I just love the Sheikh!!! I really want to attend some of lectures if they ever happen in the UK some time soon.

Wa alaikum as sallam

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

asalaam alaikum

I am also an admirer of the sunnipath.com website, it actually explains why such and such is haraam and is understandable. I also tend to get religious info from askimam.com and dar ul ifta, however askimam.com don't really clairfy why such and such is haraam. Also i find that sunnipath is more appropiate for the modern context of islam being applied as opposed to Askimam.com. This being said i do have soem crticisms on sh Nuh and his students who time and time again toe the Apologist 9-11 line. I personaly find he and his students take salaafi cheap shots and blame them for commiting acts of "terrorism", instead of pointing out that alot of the american claims are absurd eg 9/11 etc. With no evidence on the fact that muslims were responsible for "terrorism" Sh nuh and his students accuse fellow muslims (often times salaafis) on horrendous acts.

[ahsanirfan]

asalaam alaikum

I am also an admirer of the sunnipath.com website, it actually explains why such and such is haraam and is understandable. I also tend to get religious info from askimam.com and dar ul ifta, however askimam.com don't really clairfy why such and such is haraam. Also i find that sunnipath is more appropiate for the modern context of islam being applied as opposed to Askimam.com. This being said i do have soem crticisms on sh Nuh and his students who time and time again toe the Apologist 9-11 line. I personaly find he and his students take salaafi cheap shots and blame them for commiting acts of "terrorism", instead of pointing out that alot of the american claims are absurd eg 9/11 etc. With no evidence on the fact that muslims were responsible for "terrorism" Sh nuh and his students accuse fellow muslims (often times salaafis) on horrendous acts.

exact references please... i would like to see too

and besides its not just Sh Nuh who may *appear* to do this.. u will find Sh Hamza, Sh Murad, Sh Murabit do this.. so he is not the only one.... a general trend...

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

http://www.masud.co.uk/sep11.htm

Yup, i said sh nuh and his students have this problem of having an apologist 9-11 trend. And that they have accused their fellow muslims without any proof. I do believe we may have fanatics but in our day and age the kufar have commited horrendous crimes and attributed them to muslims...

[ahsanirfan]

http://www.masud.co.uk/sep11.htm

Read tht tons of times.. will comment on it later...


Yup, i said sh nuh and his students have this problem of having an apologist 9-11 trend.

His students comments please.. wanna check them out too...


And that they have accused their fellow muslims without any proof. I do believe we may have fanatics but in our day and age the kufar have commited horrendous crimes and attributed them to muslims...

can't say anything about it unless i read about the stuff in its entirety... we are after all talking about the integrity of a scholar... and scholars generally have reasons for what they say....

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

Sh nuh and his students political opinions are on the above provided link brother.

I like to re-state what i said, before some people claim i have no respect for scholars. Sh nuh and his students are great scholars and have helped me and many ppl like me to understand deen better. However, their political views have been toeing the american line and have become way to apologist after sept 11. Also it seems to me ( a third party, who has no affilaition to salaafis or sufis) that sh nuh and his students have unjustly blamed salaafis/wahaabis for acts of terrorism, knowing full well that the us govt until this day have never provided any evidence for various terrorist operations..

[ahsanirfan]

akhi the people on tht page are not his students.. they are independent people on their own....

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

from my understanding masud.co.uk is affilated with sh nuh..

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

Sh nuh and his students political opinions are on the above provided link brother.

I like to re-state what i said, before some people claim i have no respect for scholars. Sh nuh and his students are great scholars and have helped me and many ppl like me to understand deen better. However, their political views have been toeing the american line and have become way to apologist after sept 11. Also it seems to me ( a third party, who has no affilaition to salaafis or sufis) that sh nuh and his students have unjustly blamed salaafis/wahaabis for acts of terrorism, knowing full well that the us govt until this day have never provided any evidence for various terrorist operations..

as salamu alaykum dear brother

you are making very superficial comments, which generally have no basis. time and time again we hear that Sh. Hamza and Sh. Nuh are 'apologists' and 'toe the american line'.

as far as i can see, they condemn acts which are against Islam, irrespective of who carried them out, whether it be by Muslims or non-Muslims. what exactly do you mean that they become 'way to apologist after sept 11'????

at a time when we see clearly groups of Muslim who openly support acts like 9/11 and Madrid and Beslan, are we expected to keep quiet or show our disapproval.

whether the US goverment proves things or not, there are many jihadi websites in arabic, which openly support such acts (not necessarily naming the perpetrators); and others which put up videos of beheadings and so on.

at the end of the day, their opinions don't come from a vaccuum, all the scholars we are discussing here have the light of guidance, and have recourse to some of the greatest scholars alive in the Muslim world - i don't hear them condemning them, or calling them 'apologists'. Shaykh Muhammad al-Yaqoubu, for one, nearly always is open about jihad against the Americans (solidiers that is) yet he doesn't call Sh. Hamza an 'apologist' yet he is one of Sh. Hamza's teachers and recommends we listen to him....

no-one takes sides in this game - the scholars stand for the truth, be it against the Muslims or not. i disagree with you completely.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

from my understanding masud.co.uk is affilated with sh nuh..

affiliated does not equal student...

[ahsanirfan]

from my understanding masud.co.uk is affilated with sh nuh..

but the people who wrote abt "terrorism" have no affiliation with sh nuh whatsoever... except perhaps friendship (sh nuh/ sh hamza/ sh murad are friends.. not students of one)

and perhaps ure understanding is wrong because masud.co takes articles from all over the place.. it focuses more on sh nuh and sh murad.. but it doesnt restrcit itself to them....

sh nuh's known students are

Faraz Rabbani
Amjab Rasheed
Sheikh Talal
Sidi Hamza Karamali

there are others also but these are the ones who publish anything most of the time...

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

Bro pir sahib i also disagree with you, and i think you are a victim of American propoganda. First of all any sane individual would condemn 9/11, beslan, the madrid bombing. The scholars who do condemn them are indeed enjoining what is good and forbidding what is wrong. No one is saying that sh nuh and his students as well as sh hamza yusuf are not scholars or whatever. I myself have uttmost respect for them and have benefited alot from them. However, i disagree with their political views. They toe the offical goverment line and blame muslims for committing terrorism, with NO EVIDENCE ( damn i have repeated this like 3 times in this thread, what don't people understand?) Your are innocent until proven guilty, we know that the american media spreads misinformation, we know that they create fitna in the world, why are we toeing their line? Before balming the muslims we must have evidence of their involvement of terrorist attacks. If in fact muslims are responsible for 9/11, beslan and madrid they should be prosecuted to the full extent of shariah. BUT WE HAVE NO EVIDENCE EXCEPT FOR WHAT THE AMERICAN GVT TELLS US,THUS WE CAN NOT ACCUSE MUSLIMS OF DOING SUCH THINGS...

BTW-These jihadi websites are created by security agencies to claim terrorist acts, so they can capitalize on the fears of the masses of islam in general. You need to stop being naive and step up ur poli sci 101... They (americans and the likes have done the same thing to the communists of the past, they are doing the same thing to the muslims)

[ahsanirfan]

i have read sh nuh's article again... and he hasnt connected 9/11 with the wahhabis directly... he merely pointed out tht the accused (Bin Laden) belonged to the Wahhabi sect.. and he disconnected the Sunnis from the Wahhabi sect.... that is all... if there is someone else who made a direct claim connecting the Wahhabis/Salafis to 9/11 please do let us know...

the 'ulama are very precarious people.. they know what they are doing...

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

Bro pir sahib i also disagree with you, and i think you are a victim of American propoganda. First of all any sane individual would condemn 9/11, beslan, the madrid bombing. The scholars who do condemn them are indeed enjoining what is good and forbidding what is wrong. No one is saying that sh nuh and his students as well as sh hamza yusuf are not scholars or whatever. I myself have uttmost respect for them and have benefited alot from them. However, i disagree with their political views. They toe the offical goverment line and blame muslims for committing terrorism, with NO EVIDENCE ( damn i have repeated this like 3 times in this thread, what don't people understand?) Your are innocent until proven guilty, we know that the american media spreads misinformation, we know that they create fitna in the world, why are we toeing their line? Before balming the muslims we must have evidence of their involvement of terrorist attacks. If in fact muslims are responsible for 9/11, beslan and madrid they should be prosecuted to the full extent of shariah. BUT WE HAVE NO EVIDENCE EXCEPT FOR WHAT THE AMERICAN GVT TELLS US,THUS WE CAN NOT ACCUSE MUSLIMS OF DOING SUCH THINGS...

BTW-These jihadi websites are created by security agencies to claim terrorist acts, so they can capitalize on the fears of the masses of islam in general. You need to stop being naive and step up ur poli sci 101... They (americans and the likes have done the same thing to the communists of the past, they are doing the same thing to the muslims)


brother - you accuse them of 'blaming muslims' with no evidence, when we have muslims in the UK and USA who openly state that they were done by Muslims and support them!!! i personally know many Muslims who believe so, and they can give you the proof... but this is a waste of time.

and 'some' of these webistes are indeed a creation of the west - but when people know the people who create and write on these websites - are you still going to accuse them of being created by the west?

i am not a victim of american propaganda - Muslims need to wake up that indeed we do have a crisis in the Muslim world, and we can't blame the west for everything. Allah says quite clearly in the Qur'an, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change themselves.

perhaps a good talk for you to listen to is 'the current situation of the umma' by Shaykh Hasan Ali.

secondly, you - like many others, seem to think that Sh. Hamza and Sh. Nuh somehow support the actions of America also - when both have openly criticised the actions of that government. i was probably taking your line of thought at one time, but i have seen far to many Muslims who just want to live in the west, and create trouble and fitna for everyone living here. its time for the Muslims to work together, show a true picture of Islam, and work with those non-muslims who also are against the oppressive governments of the west...

[UmmIbrahimIsa]

assalamu alaikum wr wb

err...before we get off topic and turn this thread into another mindless debate or slander backbiting one... just wanted to remind each other of that insha'Allah not to let it fall into that and make assumptions or be suspicion of one another...as it says in the qur'an that some are considered a sin....
insha'Allah we can use this thread to say nice things about him, rather than make an assumption of his political views...


Allahu Alim

[Omar HH]

I personaly find he and his students take salaafi cheap shots and blame them for commiting acts of "terrorism", instead of pointing out that alot of the american claims are absurd eg 9/11 etc. With no evidence on the fact that muslims were responsible for "terrorism" Sh nuh and his students accuse fellow muslims (often times salaafis) on horrendous acts.

The poorest excuse for terrorism around the globe is that it is "a response to American terrorism." Thats the most generalized and distorted statement. Sure this does play a factor, but the Salafi movements across the globe are the major reason. Muslims are just afraid to blame themselves.

Go look at the ideologies throughout the world who say that the duty of the Muslim is to overthrow every single Government and replace it with Islam, violently, which is like this new "neo-Marxist" incorporation. Go look at the books, read them. It doesn't matter if America bombs Iraq or supports Israel. That just makes them more mad, but if America was in neither Iraq nor supporting Israel these terrorist movements which see Islam as "ideology" would still fighting them.

Maybe i'm wrong,

Allahu 'Alam.

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

Asalaam Alaikum

The muslims indeed need to wake up and look at themselves, we have indeed strayed from the path which was laid down on us by the prophet muhammed(pbuh).No one can argue otherwise, we are in a slump due to ourselves and we are in desperate need of spirtual reformation That being said living in this day and age it is absolutely neccessary to know your enemy and some of them are from within. Often times these muslim provacteurs are spies for these agencies (trust me here in canada, i know of many stories) no sane muslim would support any terrorist actions against civilians, that goes contrary to what we believe. If their is some muslims who do support sept 11 they have reacted to the opression brought upon the muslims by America and the west, and that they are reacting through emotion and complete ignorance.

Sh Nuh and the likes have made many accusations, some which is obviously true since their are groups out their who are like the khwarij and have done many unislamic things. But that doesn't do justice to the muslim cause in the west especialy when sh nuh and the likes agree to the american version of 9-11 (which has alot of serious flaws). Instead of openly criticizing the findings of 9/11, they jump on the bush bandwagon and blame the muslims, thus further alienating the muslims from the non-muslims. Sh NUh and Sh Hamza Yusuf are really intelligent men, how can they even beleive the american story? They should have said listen we have no evidence of muslims being involved. If their is sufficient evidence that implicates muslims wither they be salaafis etc, we can make a statement and write numerous articles opposing the muslims who have done it.

As we all know, as do the respected sheikhs, we can't make judgements on these terrorist attacks without a proper trial and proof of the muslims involvement. Subhanallah, no trial has been held and no proof has been given and the muslims have been found guilty? I don't want to create more probs than i have, but i just want ppl to be just and be openminded. Like i said before i luv sh nuh and sh hamza and their great scholars.. I just find it REALLY odd that they blamed muslims without any evidence. I totaly disagree with their political stances as do others, for valid reasons..

BTW- I am from the west, i luv canada for their many benefits eg health care, pension, student loans. I am not here to spread fitna, i am here to shed some light on social justice inshallah.. Check out askimams political stances and you will see what iam talking about. You will see a big difference of their political stances vs sh nuh and the likes.. I included some below enjoy...

http://islam.tc/ask-imam/view.php?q=11723
http://islam.tc/ask-imam/view.php?q=6769
http://islam.tc/ask-imam/view.php?q=4643

[abdul518ca]

What a brilliant reply by Mufti Ebrahim:


2. The Muslims have not condemned this attack simply because they believe that they are not responsible for this attack.

3. Many Muslims have condemned these attacks but since they don’t control the bulk of the media, their voices of condemnation are either played down or nor reported at all.
There's absolutely no proof that Salafis/Wahhabis are behind all these terrorists acts like Madrid, etc. But still, people like Hisham Kabbani like to mouth off about Salafis doing these things.

Not even the FBI has charged OBL with the attacks, he's only a SUSPECT. But just like the fascists in Italy made the people believe that Mussoli made the trains run on time, the Americans here have also made the people believe that OBL ordered the attacks.

IMO, Sh. Hamza and Sh. Nuh should condemn the attacks, but at the same time, they should also try to defend the fact that Muslims were not involved in all of this.

[But you can't really blame Sh. Hamza and Sh. Nuh, they made those statements right after the attacks, people like Alex Jones only relayed their findings after some time had passed, when it was too late]

[ilm_seeker]

As sallamu alaikum

I know that we shouldn't accept the likes of FOX News and CNN as reliable news sources, but we have to accept the Muslims have been behind a string of attacks in various countries.

9/11 is likely to have been perpertrated by Muslims as the wills of the 19 hijackers are available on video. It seems as if they made the videos before the attacks and they were edited afterwards by their supporters to show the explosions in the background.

Al-Qa'ida has also claimed responsibly (or congratulated the ppl who did it referring to them as "brothers") for other attacks such as in Tunisia, Kenya and I think Madrid.

Sh. Nuh is correct to condemn acts which violate Islam. However, I say that we should wait for clear proof from the groups themselves that they were responsible before blaming Muslims, like everyone else does.

Wa alaikum sa sallam

[ahsanirfan]

You will see a big difference of their political stances vs sh nuh and the likes..

akhi can u tell me where exactly sheikh nuh said anything about the attacks being salafi/wahhabi?... i made it quite clear earlier that he pointed out that the ACCUSED party (bin laden) was a Wahhabi... period.. that's ll he said....

and besides .. they made these statements quite early... now his stance is quite different.. he has on his suhba website a couple of articles dealing with such issues.. i suggest u read them....

i have yet to find a place where sh nuh (or for tht matter anyone else) made a direct link between 9/11 and the wahhabis....

if u do find something lemme know and i will check it out

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

Asalaam Alaikum

Bro, he both directly and indirectly accused the salaafi/wahaabis, u just need to look over the articles again. And iam sure u will find it...

Plz send me sh nuh and the likes newest articles on sept 11, iam looking forward to read their changed stances

BTW- Sh nuh might have made his statements quite early, but that still doesn't justify his stance, since he and the likes had no evidence. Like i said before and i will re-state it again, without evidence u can't jump to conclusions. This is a standard procedure in shariah aswell as the current man made laws... He should have taken the same stance as mufti embrahim desai..

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

As sallamu alaikum

9/11 is likely to have been perpertrated by Muslims as the wills of the 19 hijackers are available on video. It seems as if they made the videos before the attacks and they were edited afterwards by their supporters to show the explosions in the background.




Thats bogus,anyone could have fabricated those videos. Alot of muslims have rejoiced at these attacks, they are either provacteurs of these intelegince agencies, ignorant muslims or opressed muslims who have rejoiced at the fact that america can be touched...

It's IMPOSSIBLE for anyone except security agenicies to have orchestrated 9/11, everyone needs to understand this fact. If you want my evidence i will be more than happy to provide it... Muslims have the worst men and i agree upon that, however without evidence NO ONE can blame muslims for any of these terrorist crimes. It's better that you just condemn these atrocities and refrain from blaming muslims without any proof..

[Abu Suliman]

asalaam aliakam brothers can you just leave this topic who was behind 9/11 it is history now. Allah will judge and punish whoever was behind it why are we just bickering who did it does it make a differance now,it wont change anything.
regarding sh nuh & sh hamza first of all it does not befit a scholar to call a muslim wahabi use ghair muqalids etc.to use the word wahabi is not right iam sure they are more learned ppl then me could comment on this because the word wahab is a name of Allah and to use as derogatary term for the ghair muqalids i believe is not right.
regarding sh hamza i want to ask why has the man changed hes appearance after 9/11? before he use to wear sunnah clothes and also had longer beard but after 9/11 the man got a suit & tie on can anyone please explain to me why is that.
I know many scholars from u.s who did not change appearance but he did. i use to like him a lot for some reason hes views have changed alot since 9/11 and has lost hes credibility.
iam not judgeing him i just want to know why has this change happened please can anyone explain to me i would apprciate jazakalla.

[ahsanirfan]

Asalaam Alaikum

Bro, he both directly and indirectly accused the salaafi/wahaabis, u just need to look over the articles again. And iam sure u will find it...

akhi.. im talking only in reference to Sh Nuh.. not anyone else.. i have read that article again.. and he does NOT make a direct connection...


Plz send me sh nuh and the likes newest articles on sept 11, iam looking forward to read their changed stances

The articles on his website are by other people.. not by him.. but the fact that they are on tht website shows that his stance may have changed.. and besides.. he diesnt need to announce his change in stance.... u have to go through all of his speeches/talks to be able to discern that... i suggest that you do so that this matter can be cleared up...


BTW- Sh nuh might have made his statements quite early, but that still doesn't justify his stance, since he and the likes had no evidence. Like i said before and i will re-state it again, without evidence u can't jump to conclusions. This is a standard procedure in shariah aswell as the current man made laws... He should have taken the same stance as mufti embrahim desai..

It does justify it.. i guess your point of view differs...when the world attacks islam for every little thing that happens i think a "clear up" process is always necessary... depends on how u look at it...

he did NOT make a direct connection so he doesn't need to provide proof.. he only condemned the attack and said that the ACCUSED (bin laden) was a wahhabi.. he did NOT say that it was the wahhabis or indeed bin laden himself who may have done it...

[Omar HH]

I never said Salafis and Wahhabis did the attack. "The onus of proof is on the accusor" as our beloved Prophet (SAWS) said. I was just saying Salafi ideology HAS contributed to the rise of many terrorist movements throughout the globe, and these movements have accepted responsibility at least, for many of the terrorist attacks that have occured.

[ahsanirfan]

regarding sh nuh & sh hamza first of all it does not befit a scholar to call a muslim wahabi use ghair muqalids etc.to use the word wahabi is not right iam sure they are more learned ppl then me could comment on this because the word wahab is a name of Allah and to use as derogatary term for the ghair muqalids i believe is not right.

Wahhabi is merely a term. It's upto you to take whatever meaning you want to. The "derogatoriness" of a term exists in cultural norms, it doesn't necessarily have to be derogetory. Wahhabi refers to a ghayr muqallid in a general sense.


regarding sh hamza i want to ask why has the man changed hes appearance after 9/11? before he use to wear sunnah clothes and also had longer beard but after 9/11 the man got a suit & tie on can anyone please explain to me why is that.

He's been caught by the Americans not once, but twice. He's been labelled an "extremist/fundamentalist" by our Sufi man Stephen Schuartz. Daneil Pipes isn't too fond of him either. He is spokesman for Islam in the West, no one speaks out but he, so his appearance DOES matter. I guess that answers your question.


I know many scholars from u.s who did not change appearance but he did. i use to like him a lot for some reason hes views have changed alot since 9/11 and has lost hes credibility.

Sheikh Hamza himself once said that "those who follow my talks know that my views are still the same." Since I fall under such a category, I hold that his views have not changed. He certainly has become more apologetic, no doubt, but this again is explained by the fact that he is the only one who actually speaks FOR Islam, in the West. He is the major voice. There are others, but somehow his voice stands out.

[Omar HH]

It really angers me when people sit around and complain about other people's clothing when there are better things to do.

And a Wahhabi, to add what brother Ahsan was saying, is not just a ghayr muqallideen, but a ghayr muqalideen with anthropromorphic beliefs.

Shaykh Hamza (May Allah [SWT] preserve him) will insha Allah will have a bright face on the Day of Judgement when he takes the good deeds of all those who backbit and slandered him.

Jazakallahu Khayrun

[ahsanirfan]

And a Wahhabi, to add what brother Ahsan was saying, is not just a ghayr muqallideen, but a ghayr muqalideen with anthropromorphic beliefs.

:jazak: for pointing that out.

[salman]

Salamu Alaikum

I think people who think everything is an "American conspiracy" are simply not living in the real world. I remember my friend who used to go around watching "conspiracy theory videos" e.g. Aids was started by America in a Lab experiment, America is run by free masons, and other nonsense.

My personal position regarding 9/11 is that the American government knew it was happening, they may have even allowed it to happen. However, Muslims were "definitely" involved, whether in cahoots with America or simply by the act of being allowed to do the act.

This is what Shaikh Abdur Rahman ibn Yusuf told us - that muslims had some sort of involvement.

Wasalam

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

After sept 11, pentagon issued a statement saying they wanted a war within islam. Subhanallah this is whats happening. May allah preserve us from such fitna and guide all the muslims who divide us from inside..

This is my last post on this thread, i just want to add that as muslims we always assume good of our brothers, until they have been proven guilty.

[Shaykhs-Pir Sahib]

as salamu alaykum

brother harris, I am quite sure Sh. Hamza has mentioned after 9/11 that there is great doubt over who commited the acts... i am quite positive Sh. Nuh said the same thing. having said that, you are talking of an event that happened 4 years ago nearly - can we please move on. we know the acts was wrong....

second point, you seem to forget the handful of Muslims who do believe Muslims did carry it out, and as well as that, they support the act!! i beleive these are the people we should condemn and definitely criticise their political stance - it is they that make the Muslims divided and create fitna - not Sh. Hamza nor Sh. Nuh..

[Salah ud Deen]

Sh nuh and his students political opinions are on the above provided link brother.

However, their political views have been toeing the american line and have become way to apologist after sept 11. Also it seems to me ( a third party, who has no affilaition to salaafis or sufis) that sh nuh and his students have unjustly blamed salaafis/wahaabis for acts of terrorism, knowing full well that the us govt until this day have never provided any evidence for various terrorist operations..Assalaum alyikum sidi Harris. As a murid of Sheikh Nuh I can tell you that he does not "toe the American line." That is one of the most uneducated and ridiculeous comments I have heard. At the last meeting I had with the Sheikh he touched on politics very briefly and was clearly against what the US was doing.

Also I to once denied that bin Laden and Muslims had anything to do with 911 until bin Laden himself took responsiblity for the attacks on his pre-2004 US election video. Wake up brother, bin Laden and his fellow wahabi's carried out 911. It wasn't the Jews, Americans, or the Masons. It was bin Laden.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/10/29/bin.laden.transcript/http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/10/29/bin.laden.transcript/

[Omar HH]

Yeah, Bin Laden even said it:


And as I was looking at those towers that were destroyed in Lebanon, it occurred to me that we have to punish the transgressor with the same -- and that we had to destroy the towers in America so that they taste what we tasted, and they stop killing our women and children.

I can't wait till the FBI, insha Allah, catches him.

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

Asalaam Alaikum

My previous post should have been my last on this thread.

I just wanted to add that it amuses me when brothers get their info from cnn. Do i have to tell you that the same cnn outlet you quote was the same one that calimed muslims dancing in palestine rejoicing at sept 11?? DID YOU KNOW THAT PPL FOUND THAT IT WAS A CLIP 10 YRS FROM sept 11 2001? you expect me and other muslims with common sense to believe anything cnn says, knowing full well (even the non-muslims know this fact) that cnn is one of the most biased american news networks after fox?

Sorry if you get your info from cnn, i don't know what to say about you...

WALLAH BROTHER YOUR A VICTIM OF AMERICAN PROPGANDA....

WAKE UP AND GET YOUR INFO FROM ALTERNATIVE SOURCES...

BTW-Thank god i ain't american. I haven't seen so many uncle tom muslims in my life. Makes me appreciate how good we have it in CANADA.

[Salah ud Deen]

Asalaam Alaikum

My previous post should have been my last on this thread.

I just wanted to add that it amuses me when brothers get their info from cnn. Do i have to tell you that the same cnn outlet you quote was the same one that calimed muslims dancing in palestine rejoicing at sept 11?? DID YOU KNOW THAT PPL FOUND THAT IT WAS A CLIP 10 YRS FROM sept 11 2001? you expect me and other muslims with common sense to believe anything cnn says, knowing full well (even the non-muslims know this fact) that cnn is one of the most biased american news networks after fox?

Sorry if you get your info from cnn, i don't know what to say about you...

WALLAH BROTHER YOUR A VICTIM OF AMERICAN PROPGANDA....

WAKE UP AND GET YOUR INFO FROM ALTERNATIVE SOURCES...

BTW-Thank god i ain't american. I haven't seen so many uncle tom muslims in my life. Makes me appreciate how good we have it in CANADA.
Actually my brother the actual transcript came from Al Jazeera but I was having a problem getting connected to their server. I tried again and here is the link to the Al Jazeera transcript (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/79C6AF22-98FB-4A1C-B21F-2BC36E87F61F.htm) which is the exact same. May Allah(swt) forgive your name calling. Have a nice day! :cheesygri

[Harris Ibn Qureshi]

i can get a transcript about him claiming not to do it, do you also want that?

[Omar HH]

In all due respect sir,

CNN was not the only news organization who aired the tape. And it was an Arab news organization (either al-Arabiyya, or al-Jazeera - I don't remember) whom first aired it.

May Allah (SWT) bless you,

Just never ever criticize Shaykh Nuh or Shaykh Hamza or any Ullema ever again please. I don't care what they do. Ullema are ullema, be respectul.

Jazakallahu Khayrun

[Omar HH]

i can get a transcript about him claiming not to do it, do you also want that?

Who cares?

When you goto Jordan and study fiqh and aqeedah and tassawuf overseas for years and become the murshid of the tariqa you can do that. As for now, no. You do have a valid point, that it is possible that Bin Laden did not do the attacks. I find this point extremely weak to the point that it is an irrational conclusion, but you have the right to your opinion. But my whole problem concerns your blame on Shaykh Hamza and Shaykh Nuh...

"And whoever shows emnity to a friend of mine, I am at war with him" - Hadith Qudsi.

[salman]

Topic locked

Theres another topic of this genre in the Debates forum.

Wasalam