then We clothed the bones with flesh, is scientifically in accurate?

[tariqa]

Some Muslims claim the Quran has scientific facts unknown at the time therefore the Quran had to be divinely inspired.
Often cited 23:14
Then We made the Nutfah into a clot (a piece of thick coagulated blood), then We made the clot into a little lump of flesh, then We made out of that little lump of flesh bones, then We clothed the bones with flesh, and then We brought it forth as another creation. So blessed be Allah, the Best of creators.

The bones forming first and then clothed with flesh is WRONG. About 13 weeks after conception the bones form and muscles are already present BEFORE the bones. Furthermore, PRIOR to the Quran, Greeks such as Galen and Hippocrates made the same error.

Some Muslims say that Muhammad was illiterate and they ask how could have he stumble across such information?

Muhammad knew al-Harith ibn Kalada, a physician, who had access to Greek medicine.

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what do you say about the above quote?

[tariqa]

do we even know at all?

[Abu Zakariya Yahya]

do we even know at all?

:salam:

The name of the title of the thread should be, is 'science' Quranically accurate...
Because truth be told, everything that Allah subhana wa ta ala say's in his Qur'an is true, scientifically, medically, and other then that. It is human beings who lack the knowledge, understanding, and scientific ability to "proove" if the Qur'an can be understood by them scientifically.
So with that being said, We should NEVER doubt whether or not the Qur'an is 'scientically' true, but rather we should doubt whether or not science has become advanced enough to understanding the Qur'an.
For information on this perticular ayah though check this website.
http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_57.html

[tariqa]

may allah reward

thank you brother

[Reckoning]

http://www.quranicstudies.com/articles/medical-miracles/does-the-quran-plagiarise-ancient-greek-embryology.html

[Usama2]

Some Muslims claim the Quran has scientific facts unknown at the time therefore the Quran had to be divinely inspired.
Often cited 23:14
Then We made the Nutfah into a clot (a piece of thick coagulated blood), then We made the clot into a little lump of flesh, then We made out of that little lump of flesh bones, then We clothed the bones with flesh, and then We brought it forth as another creation. So blessed be Allah, the Best of creators.

The bones forming first and then clothed with flesh is WRONG. About 13 weeks after conception the bones form and muscles are already present BEFORE the bones. Furthermore, PRIOR to the Quran, Greeks such as Galen and Hippocrates made the same error.

Some Muslims say that Muhammad was illiterate and they ask how could have he stumble across such information?

Muhammad knew al-Harith ibn Kalada, a physician, who had access to Greek medicine.

_________________

what do you say about the above quote?

Salaam alaikum

From your own quote, the translation says that there was flesh before the bone and that the bone was formed within the lump of flesh, so the sequence in the Quran IS CORRECT AND THE PERSON'S CLAIM IS WRONG.

Quoted from the link by Reckoning:


"Al-Kisa'a Bil-Lahm (clothing with flesh stage of, muscles)



فَكَسَوْنَا الْعِظَامَ لَحْمًا

"Then We clothed the bones with flesh" (Surah Al-Mu 'minun, Ayah 14)



The above Ayah explicitly states that the bones are formed first and that this is followed by the formation of flesh or muscles which take their position around the bones (clothing the bones). In fact the primordia or precursors of both the bone and muscle (in the form of myotomes and selertomes( are present together with those of bones and other tissues and organs in a collective primitive structure are formed during the first 40 days and is found in the Mudghah. However, in this stage the primordia of muscle have not yet differentiated into definitive bones and muscles. As they do not have the shapes or forms of bones or muscles, the whole embryo at this stage does not have a human appearance.



During the seventh week- the skeleton begins to spread throughout the body and the bones take their familiar shapes. The embryo then starts to acquire the human appearance. At the end of the seventh week and during the eighth week the muscles take their positions around the bone forms, "definitive muscles of trunk, limbs and head are well represented and foetus is capable of some movement".



With the completion of this stage "Alkisa'a Billahm" at the end of the eighth week the embryo becomes a foetus and thus the stage of Nash'ah begins as stated by the remainder of the above Ayah.



فَكَسَوْنَا الْعِظَامَ لَحْمًا ثُمَّ أَنشَأْنَاهُ خَلْقًا آخَرَ فَتَبَارَكَ اللَّهُ أَحْسَنُ الْخَالِقِينَ

"Then We clothed the bones with flesh; then We developed out of him another creature. So blessed be Allah, the best to create". (Surah Al-Mu 'minun, Ayah 14)



The Qur'anic Ayah tells us that: clothing with flesh follows upon the bones stage. It has been explained previously that the terms used to describe various stages of development are derived from the feature which dominates and determines the shape of the embryo or foetus during that stage e.g. the shape of the skeleton determines the general appearance of the embryo in the bones stage during the 7th week; muscles do not develop at the same time but their development follows soon after. The muscles take their positions around the bones throughout the body and therefore Clothe the bones. Thus, the muscles take their well known forms and structures. This is referred to in the Qur'an:



فَخَلَقْنَا الْمُضْغَةَ عِظَامًا فَكَسَوْنَا الْعِظَامَ لَحْمًا

"Then We made of that Mudghah bones (skeleton) then We clothed the bones with flesh (muscles)..." (Surah Al-Mu 'minun, Ayah 14)



At the "Clothing with Muscles Stage" the embryo acquires human features and starts to become more straight. The external genital organs start to become differentiated.



The Qur'an has placed the stage of clothing with muscle to mark the end of embryonic stage; the foetal stage (Nash'ah) follows, as explained in the Ayah:



فَخَلَقْنَا الْمُضْغَةَ عِظَامًا فَكَسَوْنَا الْعِظَامَ لَحْمًا ثُمَّ أَنشَأْنَاهُ خَلْقًا آخَرَ فَتَبَارَكَ اللَّهُ أَحْسَنُ الْخَالِقِينَ (المؤمنون: 14).

"Then We made of that Mudghah bones (skeleton) then We clotted the bones with flesh (muscles) then We developed out of him another creation, so blessed be Allah the best to create". (Surah Al-Mu-minun, Ayah 14)



The stage of clothing with muscle occurs during the 8th week which is the end of the embryonic stage after which it goes to another stage with other features, the foetal stage or "AI-Nash'ah".
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Also from Reckoning's link is the Quranic description of the 'Mudghah' stage as not the completed form, but the embryo is still in variance.


"At the stage of the "Mudghah" other texts use the verbs "Khalaq" (creation, formation, initiation). This means that there is an active process of development. Throughout the embryo there is active differentiation in almost every system.



The Qur'an also describes the Mudghah to be consisting of differentiated and undifferented components.



ثُمَّ مِنْ مُضْغَةٍ مُخَلَّقَةٍ وَغَيْرِ مُخَلَّقَةٍ



"Then out of a chewed-like substance partly differentiated and partly undifferentiated (Mokhalaqa wa Ghair Mokhalaqa) ". (Surah AI-Haj, Ayah 5)



This superb Qur'anic Ayah for an embryo of about 1 cm. gives a description of its internal state by explaining that although the anlage of all organ systems have formed, their function has yet to appear. This is very meaningful in the sense that although there is creation of systems going on, this process is incomplete and the whole thing is just a lump of irregularly shaped tissue chewed-like substance



Thus the Qur'an has given a clear sequence of development by describing the changes of 'Alaqah to Mudghah and Mudghah to Skeleton. This sequence is supported by present day Embryology....................




After reviewing the ancient Greek ideas about embryology in more detail, summarising their main features in the above tables, and comparing them with the Qur’an, it becomes perfectly obvious, even to the casual reader, that the embryological works of Hippocrates, Aristotle and Galen etc. are completely different to that of the Qur’an.



The fact is that the Qur’an discusses many different aspects of embryology as summarised in Tables 1 & 2 using terms and expression which have no comparison in the other ancient literature. A further point to bear in mind is that the Qur’an has its own unique style. The Arabic language of the Qur’an is very poetic and rhythmic, whereas we do not find the ancient Greeks discussing embryology in any particular form or poetry.



In conclusion, the Qur’an, is totally different in terms of style, subject matter and accuracy. Hence the accusation that the Prophet and Messenger Muhammad (Allah bless him and give him peace) plagiarised ancient Greek ideas is not based on any credible evidence or sound reasoning but is the result of biased and subjective interpretation. The claim is thus utterly refuted.



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While al Harith ibn Kalada lived at the time of the Prophet (saaw), none of the enemies of Islam claimed that Quran or Quranic knowledge is from him and there are many enemies of Islam who were literate and knew this doctor, including his son al Nadr ibn al Harith.
What we have in this lie is a modern person searching to create conjecture and doubt to justify disbelief. As we know from Allah SWT, the disbeliever who rejects belief is sent in kufr regardless of the Truth, reason, common sense.

And common sense is the foundation from which belief emerges. The scientific method is not always compatible with common sense because it is restricted to the faults and deficiencies of the original hypothesis. Prejudice and bigotry in the observations of the original hypothesis prejudices the outcome.

And Allah knows best.