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Thread: Barelwi/Deobandi differences in aqeedah?

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    Default Barelwi/Deobandi differences in aqeedah?

    Assalamu Alaikum,

    Barelwi/deobandi debates...I stay away from them generally due to my lack of knowledge, also I don't want to get into an argument. I'm neither...I'm sunni hanafi but I am deobandi inclined. Somone I know who is barelwi has some objections regarding the aqeedah of deobandi scholars...I've never come across them so please could you help me to clear up these misconceptions inshallah. Jazakallah khair. Please could you just clarify these 3 objections I've mentioned and just answer them...don't want this to get out of hand.

    Assalamu Alaikum.


    1. A deobandi scholar, Ismaeel Delvi, in his book Taqwiyatul leemaan, page 58 writes

    'The Prophet May salaam be upon them should be respected only to the extent that an elder brother is respected. '

    Barelwi view on above:
    I believe this to be an insult to the holy prophet may salaam be upon them, an evil attempt to degrade his may salaam be upon thems high status. The wife of the elder brother is your sister in law, we all know how we should behave with a sister in law, but the blessed wifes of the holy prophet may salaam be upon them are 'Mothers of the believers' according to the Quran. We all also know how we are suppose to behave with our own blood related mothers. Then just think how great our respect should be for the 'Mother of the Belivers', should we call them sister in laws? Should we only respect them to an extent a sister in law is respected? Because thats exactly what we must do if we act upon the Aqeeda of the founders of the Deobandi sect. You may say this was said by one deobandi, and this isnt the aqeeda of the any other deobandi, then tell me according to the Hanafi Fiqa, anyone who insults the holy prophet may salaam be upon them is a kaffir. So tell me now are deobandies proper Hanfies? If so then why dont they call those who insult the holy prophet may salaam be upon them Kaffirs? why is it Ismaeel Delvi is highly respected wthin the deobandies?



    2. A deobandi scholar, Kasim Nanotavi writes in his book Tahzeerun-Naas, Pages 3 and 25

    To the common people, the expression "Khaatim-un-Nabiy-yeen" means the "last Prophet". To the knowdgable people this is not a correct view. Even if a Prophet was to be born after the holy Prophet May Salaam be upon them it would still have no effect on the concept of the finality of Muhammad May Salaam be upon them

    Barelwi view on above:
    Does the Quran not clearly say the holy prophet may salaam be upon them is the last propeht may salaam be upon them, is not the deniar of Quran a kaffir according to ALL fiqa not just Hanafi Fiqa?. i believe in the above to be an insult of the holy prophet may salaam be upon them, and denial of the Quran, and also amunition for anyone who wants to make a claim to prophethood after the holy prophet may salaam be upon them, In 1974 when the government of the Pakistan declared the Mirzaies as kaffirs, in the national assembley the then Mirzies leader Mirza Bashir, read this statment of Kasim Nanotavi in the dfence of Mirzaies, to this day the Mirzaies use this in support of thier false relgion. You may again say this was said by one deobandi, and this isnt the aqeeda of the any other deobandi, Well do current deobandi alims consider this statment to be kuffar or even wrong?why is it no deobandi as ever called Kasim Nanotavi a kaffir for this corrupt beleif of his? Why is it he his highly respected wthin the deobandies?


    3. A deobandi scholar, Ismaeel Delvi, in his book Taqwiyatul leemaan, page 161 writes

    'If Allah so wills He can create a million people just like Muhammad May Salaam be upon them'

    Barelwi view on above:
    Here a deobandi scholar is saying that the holy prophet may salaam be upon them isnt unique at all, all his attributes arent unique if Allah wanted he could have created a million people like the holy prophet may salaam be upon them, tell me if that was the case out of the million Muhammads which one would be the final prophet? Out of the million Muhammads whos Quran should we follow? Out of the million Muhammads who would be the leader of all the propehts? You can see how little respect the deobandi alim is showing to the unattainable rank of the holy prophet may salaam be upon them. Hes denying all the unique attributes of the holy prophet may salaam be upon them. Do the deobandies consider this statment to be according to Islam? Do they label this Kuffar? do they follow ANY Fiqa Hanafi Fiqa or any other one, when it comes declaring a fatwa on somebody who insults the holy prophet may salaam be upon them?
    In the Hereafter a terrible punishment awaits you but also forgiveness from Allah swt and His good pleasure. The life of this world is nothing but the enjoyment of delusion. (Surah al-Hadid: 20)


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    Senior Member lumumba_s's Avatar
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    Default



    I think the Barelwi (who are basically Ash'ari) basis is the veneration and esteem of the Prophet and that of the Deoband was to curtail what they saw of excess. I believe that the Barelwi beliefs are more reflective of the classical understandings, but their adab and aggression towards the Deobandis is unfortunate. They are both Ahl us-Sunnah wal-Jama'at and the best discussion of this subject was given by Mufti Muhammad ibn Adab (Deobandi), apparently at the request of Shaykh Faraz Rabbani (Ash'ari). I can't find it at the moment. Sorry, but this answer by Sidi Gibril Haddad is equally as good.
    "Among the qualities of humanness, get rid of every quality
    incompatible with your slavehood so you can answer
    when Allah calls and be near His presence."

    From al-Hikam al-'Ata'iyya of Ibn 'Ata Allah


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    Assalam Allaikum,

    Correction: Shah Ismail Shaheed (rahimullah) is certainly not:

    1. A Deobandi since he was martyred by Sikhs at Balakot long before Darul Uloom Deoband was founded or its scholars such as Maulana Qasim Nanotvi and Shaykh Rasheed Ahmed Gangohi (rahimullah) were born. How can he be a Deobandi then? This is a baseless charge.

    2. A Wahabi since he was a firm believer in the Tariqas and was a mureed of Syed Ahmed Shaheed (rahimullah). He had a harsh stance on bidats and called practices such as asking Auliya for help, making tawaf of their tombs, making sajda to their tombs as close to shirk. This is very much the Deobandi view. However, Deobandis don't call such people outright mushriks as the Wahabis do.

    Now as far as these quotes are concerned, it has been proven countless times that most of them have been taken out of context to deliberately malign the Deobandis. One simply needs to refer to the vast literature available in Urdu that has been written by Deobandis. Most recently, the following book, Aqaid Ulama-e-Deoband Aur Hisam-ul-Haramain, debunks these claims thoroughly:


    http://www.albalagh.net/bookstore/?a...view&item=0885


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    Senior Member salman's Avatar
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    Salamu 'Alaykum

    Simply: Shah Isma'il is not a hujja upon the Deobandis and we agree that he went to excess in some of the wordings he used in his Taqwiyat al Iman (see: aap beeti). As for bad adab and mistakes in usage of terms to describe the Prophet, yes they exist, but this was certainly not their intention. We overlook them and pray that Allah does to.

    Finally, we take the good wherever it lies.

    I concur with Sidi Lumumba on Shaykh Gibrils analysis.

    Wasalam
    May My Soul be sacrificed for your soul, my beloved, my master Muhammad - peace and blessing upon you- !

    روحي لروحك الفداء يا حبيبي يا سيدي محمد


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