Who was Abdullah ibn Saba?

[Saad]

A. I have only quoted few orientalists, but also shown it from authentic ShiaH and Sunni books, the role of 'Abdullah ibn Saba. Usually the orientalists favor Shiahism and if 'Abdullah ibn Saba was a fairy tale, so many of the orientalists would not have mentioned him. Even a blind person can't deny the role Ibn Saba played in the origins of Shiahism.

B. The quote of 'Allamah ibn Khuldoon was taken from Shia'hs and Shiahism, there Genesis and Evolution, by Allamah Ehsan Elahi Zahir Shahid. He was the author of many books on Shiahs and their history, and later on he was killed by the Shias and was burred in Madinah. Also its mentioned in 'Abdullah ibn Saba, Tarikh kay Aiyne Main, by Hakim Faiz Alam Siddiqui. Shah Abdul 'Aziz Dahlawi (may Allah have mercy on him) has also written in details about Ibn Saba in his magnum opus called Tuhfa Ithna Ashariyyah.

And to add to the above list:

22. And it is narrated from Imam Abu Hanifah (may Allah have mercy on him),

"hAbdullah ibn Saba was a Jewish and he [supposedly] accepted Islam during the time of Sayyiduna 'Usman (may Allah have mercy on him) and he urged the people of Egypt to kill 'Usman (may Allah have mercy on him) and he would show much love for 'Ali (may Allah have mercy on him). He was a khabis from inside and his only mission was to create fitnah among the Muslims." (Musnad Imam-i-A'zam, p.158)

عبد اللّه بن سبا كان يهوديا فاسلم ايام عثمان وهوالذى حمل اهل مصر على قتل عثمان واظهر
الميل الى على وكان خبيث الباطن غرض الفساد بين المسلمين

23. Shaykh Abdul Qadir Jaylani (may Allah have mercy on him) says in Ghunyat al-Talibin,

"Sabain sect are attributed towards 'Abdullah ibn Saba and they said 'Ali is alive and will come back before Qiyamat."

واما لسبائية فمنسوبة الى عبداللّه بن سبا من دعوهم ان عليا لم يمت وانه يرجع قبل يوم القيامة

Scan:

[Isa al-Maliki]

As-Salaamu Alaikum,

Thanks for the information akhi fillah. If it's not a problem for you i would appreaciate some more quotes. Not that i doubt the reliability but it's always nice to have some references whenever the issue might come up. If you don't feel like doing that, thanks for what you have provided so far sidi.

JazakAllah Wassalaam

[Saad]

Assalam o 'alaykum,

24. Famous Shia scholar 'Allamah Kashi narrates in his book from one of the Shiah Imam Abu 'Abdullah (may Allah have mercy on him),

"May Allah curse 'Abdullah ibn Saba, he said that 'Ali is God. But 'Ali was a servant of Allah."

لعن اللّه عبداللّه بن سبا انه ادعو الربوية فى امير المؤمنين عبدا طالباً

(Rijal-i-Kashi, p.100)

(Qamus al-Rijal, 5:46)

[Saad]

Assalam o 'alaykum,

25. Allamah Shahrastani (may Allah have mercy on him) writes:

"'Abdullah ibn Saba...was the first person who said that Imamat of 'Ali (may Allah have mercy on him) is proven from nas." (Al-Milal wa al-Nahal, 1:174)

اصحاب عبداللّه بن سبا٠٠٠ وهو اول من اظهر القول بالنص بامامة على كرم اللّه وجهه

26. Saad Bin 'Abdullah al-Ash'ari Al-Qummi said:

"Sabians are companions of 'Abdullah Ibn saba, …… 'Abdullah bin Saba, was the first who slandered Abu Bakr, 'Omar, 'Othman, and the Companions and disowned them." (Al-Maqalat wal-Firaq, p.20)

27. Imam Shah Waliullah (may Allah have mercy on him) has also written in details about Ibn Saba in his book Izalat al-Khifa;.

[ALIJAN1001]

The “Jewish Encyclopedia” says:
ABDALLAH IBN SABA
By : Hartwig Hirschfeld
A Jew of Yemen, Arabia, of the seventh century, who settled in Medina and embraced Islam. Having adversely criticized Calif Othman’s administration, he was banished from the town. Thence he went to Egypt, where he founded an antiothmanian sect, to promote the interests of Ali. On account of his learning he obtained great influence there, and formulated the doctrine that, just as every prophet had an assistant who afterward succeeded him, Mohammed’s vizier was Ali, who had therefore been kept out of the califate by deceit. Othman had no legal claim whatever to the califate; and the general dissatisfaction with his government greatly contributed to the spread of Abdallah’s teachings. Tradition relates that when Ali had assumed power, Abdallah ascribed divine honors to him by addressing him with the words, “Thou art Thou!” Thereupon Ali banished him to Madain. After Ali’s assassination Abdallah is said to have taught that Ali was not dead but alive, and had never been killed; that a part of the Deity was hidden in him; and that after a certain time he would return to fill the earth with justice. Till then the divine character of Ali was to remain hidden in the imams, who temporarily filled his place. It is easy to see that the whole idea rests on that of the Messiah in combination with the legend of Elijah the prophet. The attribution of divine honors to Ali was probably but a later development, and was fostered by the circumstance that in the Koran Allah is often styled “Al-Ali” (The Most High).
Bibliography: Shatrastani al-Milal, pp. 132 et seq. (in Haarbrücken’s translation, i. 200-201);
Weil, Gesch. der Chalifen, i. 173-174, 209, 259.H. Hir.
Source: JewishEncyclopedia,
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/vi...d=189&letter=A

[ALIJAN1001]

want more about abdullah bin saba, iran america and israel secrate relationship must visit

http://ahlehaq.com/forum/viewtopic.p...2&p=2515#p2515
http://ahlehaq.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=11
http://universal-ama-scholarship.blo...1_archive.html

[al_mumin]

Aslaaam..

I only joined yesterday am so far very surprised with Khanbaba's posts. They are very good to read and i call them a learning curve.. Mashallah this brother says it as it is. Allah has given him the wisdom to put people in their places.

I dont care about sects (fitnas) as long as you recognise HAQ.

Asalaam

[ibnuidrees]

to qoute our own sharee sources and historians is moot because at the very onset they deny all our sources claming them to b fabricated. hence i would go with the brother who qouted there own books in identifing abdullah bin saba. even that they might deny based on taqiyyah. hence arguing with them is not unlike banging ones head on a wall.

[zinc]

A. I have only quoted few orientalists, but also shown it from authentic Shia and Sunni books, the role of Abdullah ibn Saba. Usually the orientalists favour Shiaism and if Abdullah ibn Saba was a fairy tale, so many of the orientalists would not have mentioned him. Even a blind person can't deny the role ibn Saba played in the origions of Shiaism.

B. The qoute of Allamah ibn Khuldoon was taken from Shia's and Shiaism, there Genesis and Evolution, by Allamah Ehsan Elahi Zaheer shaheed. He was the author of many books on Shias and their history, and later on he was killed by the Shias and was burried in Medina. Also its mentioned in Abdullah ibn Saba, Tareekh kay Aiyne Main , by Hakeem Faiz Alam Siddiqui. Hazrat Shah Abdul Aziz Dehlvi [r.h] has also written in details about ibn Saba in his magnum opus called Tuhfa Isna Ashariya.


And to add to the above list:


22. And it is narrated from Imam Abu Hanifa [r.a]:

"Abdullah ibn Saba was a Jewish and he [supposedly] accepted Islam during the time of Hazrat Usman [r.a] and he urged the people of Egypt to kill Hazrat Usman [r.a] and he would show musch love for Hazrat Ali [r.a]. He was a khabees from inside and his only mission was to create fitna among the Muslims."

عبد اللّه بن سبا كان يهوديا فاسلم ايام عثمان وهوالذى
حمل اهل مصر على قتل عثمان واظهر
الميل الى على وكان خبيث الباطن غرض الفساد بين المسلمين

[Musnad Imam-e-Azam page 158]


23. Shaikh Abdul Qadir Jailani [r.h] says:

"Sabain sect are attributed towards Abdullah ibn Saba and they said Hazrat Ali [r.a] is alive and will come back before Qiyamat."

واما لسبائية فمنسوبة الى عبداللّه بن سبا من دعوهم ان عليا لم يمت وانه يرجع قبل يوم القيامة

[Ghunyat al-Talibeen]


and more can be provided.

“The reason for those great Ulema to report everything shows their honesty and trustworthiness and greatness. They reported even if it goes against their own belief as in the case of imam ibn Jarir Tabari.

His tafseer nagates things that he has reported in Tarikh.

Some Ulema either not paying special attention or relying on those before them blindly such as "some scholars have said that" etc as is the case with many reports you will find in our currentt discussion.

This abdullah bin Saba's existence, actually, that is another flawed focus. If we are claiming that he did such and such then we should 'prove' such and such.

I have read extensively about abd allah bin Saba from original sources from their first appearance in third/fourth century in Tabari to those who did not mention any chain?

The image in Tabari of abdullah bin Saba is of a powerful man that single handedly he manages to destabilise and overthrows Hazrat Osman al-Ghani's rule and mesmerises the great and old sahaba Hazrat abu Zar Ghaffari and the seventh muslim in islam Hazrat Ammar Yasir that they were greatly influnced by him.

The role of ibn Saba as depicted by reports in Tabari is such that all of sudden the guy comes in the times of Hazrat Usman al-Ghani and eventually becomes responsible for the end of the caliphate of Hazrat Usman bin Affan.

In terms of causality a black/white simple mechanism to explain away the downfall.

When ibn Saba has been given such a crucial role in downfall of the third Caliph then by historical necessity others before or contemporary of Tabari, atleaset, must have given an account of abdullah bin Saba's pivotal role but we find that Imam Tabari (d. 310 AH) reporting from saif bin Omer,(unanimously, a liar and fabricator according to sunnis as well the three others from his chain) along with other factors highlights this cause via saif bin omer yet other contemporary historians such as Ibn Saad (d. 230 AH)in tabaqaat and Baladuri (d. 297 AH)in ansab al-ashraf do not mention this character whilst reporting on the downfall or end of Hazrat Usman's caliphate! it is things of this nature and mouth of a fabricator that has led researchers deny the role atleast as presented by saif bin umer.

Dr. Taha Hussain the Egyptian sunni author, for example, in his al fitan al kubra has denied the existence of abdullah bin Saba on account of such reasons of both text and testimony.

Not to mention the 'invention' of some fictitious Sahaba by Saif bin Omer as we will elucidate from muhaddiseen that no such Sahabi exists other than from what Saif says?

If you remove Saif bin Omer from the equation of abdullah bin Saba then a different account of ibn Saba emerges.

Saif's ibn Saba emerges in time of Hazrat Usman(RA) and without Saif'e reports ibn Saba emerges in times of Hazrat Imam Ali (RA)...that alone should be sufficient for a historian.

However, Saif's ibn Saba is the originator of shia sect but other than Saif, ibn Saba is calls “ Imam Ali GOD”...now, do you know Ismailis, Zaidis, Isna Asharis that call Imam Ali GOD?

Moreover, ibn Saba from other than Saif, was killed by Imam Ali etc.

1. السري this first reporter was siri bin ismaelkufi or siri bin asim died in 258. both were 'fabricators and liars' see, (tehdheeb al-tehdheeb V3, Page46. tarikh al khateeb V9 P193, mizal al-itidal V1 P37, lisna al-mizan V3 P13.)

2. Shuaib bin ibrahim al-kufi: this reporter is majhool/unknown. see (mizal al-itidal V1 P447, lisna al-mizan V3 P145)

3. Saif bin Omer: this reporter reports fabrications and attributes them to trustworthy people. see (mizan al-itidal V1 P438, tehdheeb al-tehdheeb, V4 P295)

4. Yazeed faq'asi: unknown reporter and there absolutely no mention of him in any books of reporters.
A lot more could be said and analysed but it is sufficient to say that consistency is key pillar we must hold onto otherwise kama tudeeno tudaan. You may reap what you sow.

Shia are also guilty of making use of reports when it suits them like our brothers and this cycle will continue. Another thing is that there is no mention of ibn Saba in our hadith literature such Sihah Sitta whereas they fill in gaps for other historical happenings!

Actually, there are contradictions between Saif's accounts of Islamic history and that which is reported in other sources, for instance, Sahih Bukhari.

Dr. Abdul Aziz Hulabi, chair of Islamic History at King Saud University, KSA.

Dr. Husayn Atwan, in an direct way, but explicit enough.
Those have completey rejected the entire existence of Ibn Sab'a.

Scholars like Al Arabi At-Tabbani have exposed that his role was "much smaller and insignificant than worth mentioning".

Since all the Salaf of the historians, Hadith scholars, narrators, did not mention Ibn Sa'ba before the sudden appearance of Sayf bin Amr.

That tells you something.

Furthermore, the Islamic historians, while narrating Sayf's narrations, have ALWAYS concluded otherwise.


In the book called 'man hum as-shia' by a salafi callled Ahmed Jawadu, published by Dar al-Ameer.

It is a refutation of Shia isna Asharis. ( page 46), he gives a list of sunni scholars of late that have denied the existence or details about abdullah bin Saba with regards to originator of Shia isna Asharis.

1. dr. taha hussain in al-fitn al-kubra
2. dr. ali sami an-nishar in al-fikr al-falsafi fil islam
3. dr. hamid hanafi daud in at-tashuo zahira tabiya fi itar ad-dawa al-islamia
4. dr. mohammed kamil hussain in adab misr al-fatimiya
5. abdul aziz al-halabi in his book abudullah bin saba
6. ustaz hasan bin farhan al-maliki has written many articles about his denial.
7. dr. jawad ali in his article of the name abdullah bin saba, issue 6 of almajma alilmi.
8. dr. abdullah samarai in his book al-ghulu wa alfiraq alghaliya fil hidarat alislamiya.

Then he goes on to give a list shia scholars.

Although admits that abdullah bin Saba has no mention in Sihah Sitta or the Matun Araba( four principle texts of shia) but gives a reference from Bukhari on page 37 that indirectly it proves that Hazrat Imam Ali burned the followers of abdullah bin Saba as we see in history!”


Sahih Bukhari- Volume 9, Book 84, Number 57:
Narrated 'Ikrima:

Some Zanadiqa were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"

[dbzclips]

salam, a few weeks ago, i wrote a long post (took me almost an hour) analyzing every claim about abdullah ibn saba, then proved that he didn't exist

i got an email saying that this thread was replied to (because i subscribed to it)

come to find out, my post was deleted!!

this is dishonest, and deleting my post refuting the myth of abdullah ibn saba (who was invented by sayf ibn umr) does not reflect the actions of a muslim

hiding the truth like this only confirms my belief that shi'ism is the correct path that that many elements of sunnism is full of conspiracies and half-truths

i can't be bothered to write that long post again, so i ask you to read the following articles, to prove that abdullah ibn saba didn't even shi'ism:
http://www.*************/encyclopedia/chapter10/1.html
http://www.*************/encyclopedia/chapter10/2.html
http://www.*************/encyclopedia/chapter10/3.html
http://www.*************/encyclopedia/chapter10/4.html
http://www.*************/encyclopedia/chapter10/5.html

please note: the above articles are only for those who actually wish to learn. those who wish to remain ignorant, like the wahabi nasibi who deleted my post, can keep on playing. you will be held accountable for your actions on the Day of Judgment. I pray that i never hide truths like some have

and for those of you not involved with this, i apologize that you had to read this

peace be upon those who follow the right guidance

EDIT: replace "************" with al-islamDOTorg