Forged Hadith Qudsi

**loveProphet** · 02-04-2007, 01:46 PM

Is this Hadith Qudsi(can't remember exact words) forged:

"I would not have created the heavens and the stars etc if it were not for you(the Prophet

)).

**loveProphet** · 02-04-2007, 04:06 PM

Bump, anyone?

**tilmeedh** · 02-04-2007, 04:11 PM

Forged, but the meaning is true.

**Husain** · 02-04-2007, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by tilmeedh

Forged, but the meaning is true.

Please mention the proof showing the meaning to be true.

**umm_madina** · 02-04-2007, 07:22 PM

Originally Posted by soofi_saheb

Please mention the proof showing the meaning to be true.

Assalamualikum

There was a discussion before on this...

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...+Allah+created

“Know that no Muslim doubts that all of Allah’s blessings are worthy of thanks, in specific the more select ones. Then, within them, there are blessings specifically related to the religion and within these religiously related blessings particularly those that exceed others in greatness. Then within them is the single blessing that is the root of all religious and worldly blessings. What is this blessing? The coming of the Master of the Worlds, the Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace), whose religious bounties and blessings were disseminated and poured forth into the world. You are the fountain of all worldly blessings, not only for Muslims but the whole macrocosm. This is why Allah Most High said, ‘We have not sent you except as a mercy to the worlds.’ Notice, how the word ‘worlds’ does not specify human or non-human or Muslim or non-Muslim. Therefore, it can be gleaned that the existence of the Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace) is a mercy for everything regardless of whether it is flesh and blood or not or whether it is after the Prophet’s time or before.

It is not far-fetched to understand this for that which was after the Prophet’s (Allah bless him and grant him peace) time, but in order to be a mercy for that which came before him his existence was granted first. This existence was one of light and the Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace), existing as this light, was the very first of creation. In the realm of the spirits this light was completed and cultivated until the final period when, in the good-fate of this ummah, this light was gloriously illuminated in bodily form in order to brighten the Universe.

Thus, the Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace) is the cause of mercy for all the worlds. Therefore, the existence of the Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace) being the basis and root for all other blessings is established both textually and intellectually.”

Qutb al din Maulana Rashid Ahmad Gangohi (May Allah santify his secret) stated in his Fatawa, when asked about the narration “The first thing Allah created was my light” and “If it were not for you I would not have created the universe”:

http://alchishti.wordpress.com/2006/...f-ali-thanawi/

wa'salam

**Husain** · 02-04-2007, 07:27 PM

The discussion of what was created first is a seperate matter.
The one being discussed here is that nothing would have been created if it wasn't for Nabi (Sallallahu Alaihi wasallam).

It is a common discussion, with some Muhadithin claiming that inspite of the hadith being fabricated, the meaning if proven, yet they are unable to produce proof showing the meaning to be correct.

**leo28** · 02-04-2007, 07:32 PM

What is qudsi? is that superior to normal hadith?

**tilmeedh** · 02-04-2007, 07:46 PM

@soofi saheb, I found this reasonable enough: >here<
@leo28, a hadith Qudsi is one in which Allah is the one speaking in the first-person mode.

ws

**umm_madina** · 02-04-2007, 07:48 PM

Originally Posted by soofi_saheb

The discussion of what was created first is a seperate matter.
The one being discussed here is that nothing would have been created if it wasn't for Nabi (Sallallahu Alaihi wasallam).

It is a common discussion, with some Muhadithin claiming that inspite of the hadith being fabricated, the meaning if proven, yet they are unable to produce proof showing the meaning to be correct.

Assalamualikum,

Okay, Allahu Alaam.

What is qudsi? is that superior to normal hadith?

Hadith Qudsi are traditions related by the Prophet Muhammad (saw) Peace be upon him, that Allah has said himself.

wa'salam

**leo28** · 02-04-2007, 07:49 PM

[QUOTE=tilmeedh;181984@leo28, a hadith Qudsi is one in which Allah is the one speaking in the first-person mode.
ws[/QUOTE]

I still could not grasp, if you could explain it further please.