Muslim Traitors-The enemy within

[leonidis]

Traitor is a very big accusation - Allah says "Oh believers abstain from suspicion, for indeed much suspicion is a sin. And spy not." (49:12)

A brother also told me that Husain and Nawaz have said that there is difference of opinion on the prohibition of homosexuality and the obligation of the hijab. Husain has openly said that the "Islam of 2,000 years ago" [sic] is no longer applicable and that it must be modernised. Apparently, Husain and Nawaz were together at Hamza Yusuf's event at Friend's House last weekend.

This sudden change of heart over these issues strikes me as a little odd.

I note that both of them are from SOAS - is this a neo-orientalist attack??

First things first " A brother told me"!!!!! What on earth is this???? This is nothing but heresay and suspicion!!! Show me one quote from Maajid Nawaz that can substantiate this slander.

If one sees a shopkeeper doing something doubtful in their dealings, one may have operational caution and avoiding dealing with them. However, one cannot believe that they are involved in the haram.

Before I continue, let me reiterate my previous post. Ed Hussain and Maajid Nawaz cannot be compared.

Hussain is machiavellian, ambitious and is effectively all things to all men. He no more believed in the ideology of HT back in the day as he does his current set of ideas. Simply put , he will sing the song of the highest bidder.

When circumstances make matters clear, as in the case of Ed Hussein, one may believe one’s suspicions after all it comes straight from the horses mouth.

Nawaz on the other hand has never been quoted of having expressed anything deviant or kufr. It is our duty to remain silent and to defend this brother untill we have clear reason to believe otherwise.

Hussain has gone on record as saying that Maajid now backs him and he influenced his decision to leave. Why should we believe a word of what Hussain has to say?

Hussain is a treacherous and desperate loner, out in the cold and he will subvert anything or anyones comments to his ends. This is surely what he has done when putting his own warped spin on Maajids reason for leaving HT.

Maajids track record speaks for itself in terms of his work for Islam and his struggles. It is wrong for us to jump to conclusions and cast suspicion on this brother.

Based on current evidence, for all we know Maajid has left HT to join Tablighi Jamaat and has gone on a 40 day trip!!! Now im not saying this is the case but we have no reason or proof to believe the worst of him.

Whatever Maajid has to say will be interesting no doubt. Im not saying im going to agree with what he has to say necessarily, but whatever the case I know Inshallah that it will be within a legitimate Islamic framework.

I know that Nawaz would never say anything Kufr or any of the disgusting things that have been attributed to him on account of some vague association with Hussain. On the contrary this is an indictiment on Hussain, that mere association with the man can lead to all sorts of disgusting slander being directed at you.

Its no more unthinking than people casting suspicion about me because some random woman stopped me in the street yesterday and asked me for directions. I suppose that means i was chatting her up or she was my girlfriend.

Suspicion is haraam.

[Kaashif_Nawaz]

Assalamu Alaykum,

Rest assured Maajid Nawaz does not believe that homosexuality is allowed in Islam, or the things that "Ed" is alleged to have said in the media. May I remind you all of the words of our creator in Surat al-Hujjaraat: "Oh you who believe!, avoid speculation, because in some cases it is a sin". Maajid has not yet spoken publicly about why he left, but rumors are abound, about him, his reasons, his link to Ed and me apparently being against him. The rumors are all baseless, as he has not spoken yet, even to HT members whom he left.

Please refrain from such speculation about my brother, and criticise if you deem necessary when he speaks for himself, based on facts not fiction.

Jazakum Allahu Khayr
Kaashif Hassan Nawaz Saleemi
(AKA Hassan from the Hassan and Habibah Show on Islam Channel)

HassanAndHabibah.blog.co.uk

[Showkat]

Assalamu Alaykum,

Rest assured Maajid Nawaz does not believe that homosexuality is allowed in Islam, or the things that "Ed" is alleged to have said in the media. May I remind you all of the words of our creator in Surat al-Hujjaraat: "Oh you who believe!, avoid speculation, because in some cases it is a sin". Maajid has not yet spoken publicly about why he left, but rumors are abound, about him, his reasons, his link to Ed and me apparently being against him. The rumors are all baseless, as he has not spoken yet, even to HT members whom he left.

Please refrain from such speculation about my brother, and criticise if you deem necessary when he speaks for himself, based on facts not fiction.

Jazakum Allahu Khayr
Kaashif Hassan Nawaz Saleemi
(AKA Hassan from the Hassan and Habibah Show on Islam Channel)

HassanAndHabibah.blog.co.uk

Ws Kashif

Good comment, please get in touch with me inshAllah via email.

[tazkiyyah]

Sidi

Point taken about hizb at tahreer.We differ with them a lot.
BUT they have matured a little over the decades-in the uk at least.

For example,
who would have recognised this as being the page
of a tahreeri?http://hamzatzortzis.blogspot.com/

[Kaashif_Nawaz]

ASA Showkat,

I'm not sure if I know you. Regardless of if you are, who I think you are, your "poem" was irresponsible, short sighted, speculative, counter-productive, wrong and un-Islamic.

Look at what our brother "Ed" is now saying about you and HT: http://www.newstatesman.com/200706180016

Nabhani was a sufi, alim, intellectual, calm and collected thinker who founded hizb ut-tahrir not be a bunch of saber rattling, rabble rousing, youth in the west. Any emotive language he did use had the right context (e.g. Israel), the kind of language you used is wholly inappropriate for a mature da'ee. It sounds like something a teenager involved in a gang would write about someone who joined another gang!

The prophet (saw) said that if one can control two thing, one would attain Jannah: the mouth, and what is between the legs.

Please think about it, take my naseeha.

Wallahu alim,
Ma'Salam

Hassan

[sufisticated]

ASA Showkat,

I'm not sure if I know you. Regardless of if you are, who I think you are, your "poem" was irresponsible, short sighted, speculative, counter-productive, wrong and un-Islamic.

my sentiments exactly.

in fact, i am not surprised one bit that brother showkat is with HT.

and this is just a prime example of how HT has failed in the UK.

it has failed to inculcate into its members any form of tarbiyyah, or development of the islamic personality.

i spoke to a member of ht the other day, a good friend of mine, and he admitted that many members of the party neglect their islamic duties e.g. learning fard al-ayn, arabic, tajweed etc, tazkiya, akhlaq

when shabab have no access to ulama who have been trained properly in the shari'a sciences, they write poems like this.

...brother showkat - you really have not done your party a favour with this. many of the members had become rather sobre of late... this is just a step back for you all

[mushy1234]

Kaashif, I read Ed Husain's article in New Statesman where he claims that Showkat Ali is a member of HT - however from what I know Showkat is not a member or a HT activist. I think Ed has made yet another error.

In any case, Showkat scored a huge own goal with his "poetry". Ed Husain's account of HT was 15 years old and most people in the Muslim community know that they have changed a lot since the departure of Bakri. What Showkat did was allow Husain to argue that the HT he knew back in the early 1990s [who didn't do death threats then although he alleges their involvement in a murder in Newham college] was exactly the same as the HT of today.

Showkat should admit that he is not a member of HT and admit the error that he made in writing this ridiculous poetry.

Wrt Maajid - I agree that we must not cast aspersions, but it is intriguing that he has not denied Ed's allegation that he is close to him and also intriguing that the poster above mentions they were together at a Shaykh Hamza Yusuf event.

[sufisticated]

who would have recognised this as being the page
of a tahreeri?http://hamzatzortzis.blogspot.com/

i knew the first time i visited his blog.

aside from the language used, take a look at the theme of articles, the political stances, the links (!), and the talks he holds (proof of God etc - standard HT themes).

if you are familiar with HT, you can spot it a mile off. just like i did with br. showkat ali.

in fact, i once attended a jumu'a khutba. i had a feeling the khateeb was from HT about 5 mins into the sermon. lo and behold, at the end, he informed the jama'a about a march ht was organising that weekend.

a little tiresome, i have to say

[YasN]

Assalaamu Alaikum,

As someone who has known/knows the 3 people who are the topic of this thread, i feel that i should add something to this thread.

Showkat - Bro, when we used to see each other more regular then we do now (good old East ham days ), i would think that you are a great brother. Someone that was committed to the elevating the state of our noble Ummah and serious in bettering your own understanding of the deen as a whole. I don't think that has changed, but i think you made a mistake in writing that poem. Apart from the obvious "Showkat the fanatic" attack (New statesmen article), more importantly is the Etiquettes of Disagreement in Islam... Yes of course you believe that the arguments that Mehboub (Ed... go back to using a muslim name ) is coming out with are unislamic/islamically weak (i certainly would not disagree with you), we should still stick firmly to the examples of Sahabah and the classical scholars in how they debated with each other.

Mehboub (Ed) - Admittedly i didn't know Mehboub that well, i met him and spoke to him on a number of occasions but more as an acquaintance then a friend. But his description of what happened in Newham during his time in HT are just wrong (i pray that they are mistakes and not deliberate lies)... I was there at East Ham college a few days before the murder, when Sayyid initially came. The murder had nothing to do with the Dawa or Hizb ut Tahrir, NO member or student of Hizb ut Tahrir were convicted of the crime. Another description which i actually find pretty funny is the description of Eisa al-Hindi, he is described as someone who went to India and eventually ended up fighting Indian troops in Kashmir... ROFL iam sorry but i know Eisa very well (he us currently living in East London not Tora Bora lol )... Eisa's forced visit to India was a traumatic experience for him, where he was drugged, beaten and generally coerced in to leaving Islam... Mashallah the brother is strong and did not. Upon returning he lived with me... Eisa is in No Way a Jihadi! Mehboub, as I said earlier, just got it all plain wrong! Apart from the historical inaccuracies in his book, the views he propagates now IMHO are also wrong and weak... But i believe it is important they are discussed and debated within the framework of Islam and with reference to the classical (and contemporary) scholars. One mistake i feel he makes is the dismissal of any politically inspired Scholar (such as Mawdudi and Nabhani). Since the destruction of the Islamic State (and even before), there have been a large number of Scholars that insisted that political activity (within the framework of Islam) is needed.. These include some great names such as Afghani, Rashid Rida, Hassan al Banna, Nabahani, Mawdudi, Qardawi, Sheikh Yasin, Sayyid Qutb, Uthaymeen, Salmaan AlAwda etc etc that all discussed a need for political activity in some form or another... Now we may not agree with them all but to dismiss them and there views is a major mistake as they make up IMHO the Ulama of contemporary Islam (Islam after the destruction of the Khilafah) as do other scholars who may not agree in political activity. This is why i believe it needs to be discussed, the ummah is at an impasse as to how to establish Islam as away of life and we are at a stage where all these differing views need to form some kind of middle ground. Iam not saying, as Mehoub says, that we need to remove all political Islamic groups... Rather there needs to be more collaboration and join initiatives based on common ground.

Maajid - What can i say... Maajid is my first couisn , we grew up together... in our childhood we (Maajid, Kaashif, my brother and I) almost burnt down my house I visited him in Prison a number of times.... My point i know him well. On a personal level i request that people STOP making up slander in regards to Maajid... He says clearly that Homosexuality is Haram and Qat'ai (definite), that there is no debate on this issue. Unlike a lot of people that *think* they know why he left HT, i have spoken to him... Although at the moment i disagree with him, it is an issue that i am spending time to think about. I urge all to wait until Maajid decides to publicly give the reasons for his departure, until then everyone should refrain from speculating and/or spreading gossip. Once its public then disagree/agree with him BASED ON WHAT HE SAYS. The issue in regards to the corrupt idea "Guilty by Association" is just pathetic and is used by shallow people. Just because he was 'seen' with Mehboub at a Hamza Yusuf talk, does not mean a) he agrees with Mehboub b) agrees with Hamza Yusuf c) agrees with them both it may turn out that he does (although i know he doesn't agree with them totally ), BUT that understanding should come about AFTER seeing what he has to say.

To finish... Whatever we do, should be purely be based on pleasing Allah (swt) not a like or dislike of a person/group. We should be sincere in seeking the truth and part of this is listening to views that differ with our own. I am still a supporter of Hizb ut Tahrir, that may change in the future or it may not. One thing that i have learned though is first and foremost our love for our brothers (and sisters) should be unconditional (not on party lines). We should seek to unify this Ummah even if it means doing things that make us feel uncomfortable, as IMHO the unity of the Ummah is the most important issue for us.

In the end i pray to Allah (swt) to strengthen our hearts and to alleviate us from the misery we are currently suffering

Yasser

[London]

Wa alaikum salam,

i heard advice that we should not love our brother too much as he may betray us. This is good advice.

we may judge a person as sincere, but we don't really know him (even close family).

He may be very sincere to his twisted desires. Perhaps he is a pragmatist who loves to argue and win debates, so that is why he "carried the dawa". Perhaps he only joined HT as he loved to debate. Perhaps he sought knowledge to help him raise his profile, to help him win debates, maybe he told himself it was for the sake of the dawa. This is not the same as being for Allah's sake. Maybe it was really for Allah's sake. Only Allah knows.

we should not assume sincerity just because one suffers for his activity. The egypt 3 brothers didn't choose jail, it happened to them. They were rounded up due to thier associations with others. What is more important when judgeing them, is if they continue thier activity even after knowing what will happen if they do. They met many sellouts inside, who people also thought were very sincere.

don't speculate, judge a persons actions by what is apparrent. If he is pragmatic, then he is that - even if he dresses it up in islamic words. If he calls for secularism, then he is calling for kufr, even if he claims its islamic as so and so said so too.

who said what is irrelevant, only the evidence they present matters. If it is a true ijtehad that has a hope of being correct, they i'll respect it. But if it originated from desires and then texts were twisted to justify it then it should be called kufr. You must study basic principles to be able to make that judgement. Your sincerity to allah is paramount, but you must be able to distinguish islam from kufr.

it is only allah who guides. He is muqallib ul quloob. He can misguide a guided person, and vice versa. Ask Him for guidance. Be grateful to Him and dispell any arrogance from your hearts.

an ex hizbi talking kufr, even if he is fresh from prison, is still talking kufr. Pray that he be guided and that we are protected from his evil.