Ibn Taymiyyah and his Kitab al Arsh

**ozgurislam** · 25-11-2007, 01:25 PM

As salamu aleykum,

Recently i saw this quote;

Ibn Taymiyyah says in his Kitab al Arsh:

''Allah sits on his Arsh, he has reserved also a place for Rasulullah (saw) to sit together with him.''

Anyone knows more about this Kitab al Arsh?

Was salaam

**abdul_karim** · 25-11-2007, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by AhlaSunnah

As salamu aleykum,

Recently i saw this quote;

Ibn Taymiyyah says in his Kitab al Arsh:

''Allah sits on his Arsh, he has reserved also a place for Rasulullah (saw) to sit together with him.''

Anyone knows more about this Kitab al Arsh?

Was salaam

There's actually a hadith that says this, but its authenticity is disputed.

**fahid** · 25-11-2007, 03:29 PM

It was narrated by Ibn Abbas (ra) I believe, but it's confusing because it would imply a Christian concept (aka Jesus (as) sitting on the right side of the throne) and an Anthropomorphic idea.

**abdul_karim** · 25-11-2007, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by fahid

It was narrated by Ibn Abbas (ra) I believe, but it's confusing because it would imply a Christian concept (aka Jesus (as) sitting on the right side of the throne) and an Anthropomorphic idea.

It's only confusing to those who have been deceived by Greek philosophical notions of what God is. Those who place their faith in the Qur'an and Sunnah can take such things as they are, bi la kayf.

**Sadia90** · 25-11-2007, 04:19 PM

thank u for ur good questiin brother. Well, there are many hadith about Muqame mehmood which will give to the Holy Prophet (saw) and the maqame mahmood is that on right side of Arsh will be a chair of Holy prphet (saw) on the day of judgement.

Haq Ali
Ya Ali

**Colonel_Hardstone** · 25-11-2007, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by abdul_karim

There's actually a hadith that says this, but its authenticity is disputed.

Asslamo Allaikum,

IF it is a disputed Hadeeth then Aqeedah cannot be derived from it.

And we cannot do Taqleed of Shaykhul-Islam (RA) or any other human on Aqeedah EVEN IF HE HAS written such a thing.

Can someone quote the Hadeeth and the source please, out of interest.

Aqeedah is only from Qur'aan & Authentic Sunnah.

**MohammadMufti** · 25-11-2007, 06:13 PM

I've never seen this, can you bring the exact citation from what page of this 'kitab al arsh' it says this?

**ryameen** · 25-11-2007, 06:15 PM

Assalamualaykum,

Mufti Soofi_Saheb. Would you please shed some light on this matter?

**fahid** · 25-11-2007, 06:27 PM

About Arsh:

"Most of the early Muslims (salaf) considered this [f: i.e. the details and reality of the Kursi, not its existence as a body] from the verses whose meaning is not decisively established (mutashabihat). Thus, they consigned its knowledge to Allah Most High, while affirming absolute transcendence and exaltedness to Allah Most High.” [Alusi, Ruh al-Ma`ani, 3.11] (Link)

From my understanding many scholars have said that the Arsh is a physical body and a creation of Allah. On the other hand we know that Allah is "above" the Arsh.

Isn't the concept of Rasullilah (salalahu alahi wasalam) sitting beside Allah a figurative thing? Also, how is this related to Al-Wasilat the highest paradise reserved for the Prophet (salalahu alahi wasalam)?

**Sad ibn Abu Waqqas** · 25-11-2007, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by abdul_karim

It's only confusing to those who have been deceived by Greek philosophical notions of what God is.

What Greek philosophical notions would those be, Sidi? I am familiar with Aristotle's philosophical notion of God, and this ancient Greek philosopher very clearly believed that God lived literally beyond the heavens.

The idea that God does not exist in space and time is an Ash'ari notion, but where do we find it among the Greeks? It is certainly not there among the Greeks that I have read....