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Thread: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

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    Default Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    In reference to the following Hadith:

    “I am the city of knowledge and Ali is its gate.”


    It was related by al-Hakim, at-Tabarani and others. It was also related by at-Tirmidhi with the wording, “I am the House of Wisdom, and Ali is its Door.”

    (this hadith is used by 99% of the Shiites when they talk with Sunnis most sunnis dont know this hadith nor do they know the statements of the scholars regarding this hadith)

    (let us look what the Scholars of Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jamaah have said about this hadith

    Daraqutni labeled the Hadith as mudtarib (shaky), both in isnad and text.
    Tirmidhi
    labeled it is ghareeb (weak) and munkar (rejected).
    Bukhari said that the Hadith has no sahih narration and declared it un-acknowledgeable.
    Qurtubi said about this Hadith in al-Jame’ li Ahkam al-Quran: “This Hadith is Batil (false)!”
    Ibn Maeen said that the Hadith is a baseless lie.
    Dhahabi considered it a forgery and included it in his book on forged Hadiths.
    Al-Hakim declared that it is weak. Amongst others who dismissed the Hadith are Abu Zur`ah, Abu Hatim, Yahya bin Saeed, etc.
    Albani declared the Hadith to be Mawdoo (fabricated).



    sources:

    The Hadith (i.e. the city of knowledge…) has been shown/declared to be false/fabricated by the following scholars:

    Yahya Bin Ma’een
    Source: al Jarh wat-Ta’deel 6/99
    Su’alat ibn Junayd #185
    Tareekh Baghdad 11/205

    Ahmad Bin Hanbal

    Source: Tareekh Baghdad 11/49

    Ibn Hibban
    Source: al Majruheen 2/136

    Ibn ’Adi
    Source: al Kamel fi ad-Du’afa 1/311 & 316

    Al-Daraqutni
    Source: Ta’liqat ‘ala al Majruheen 179

    Ibn Tahir al-Maqdisi
    Source: Dhakhirat al Huffadh 5/2578 - Tadhkirat al Huffadh #136

    Ibn Al-Arabi al Maliki
    Source: Ahkam al Quran 3/86

    Ibn A’sakir
    Source: Tareekh Dimashq 45\321

    Ibn Al-Jawzi
    Source: Al Mawdu’at 2/112-116

    Al-Nawawi
    Source: Tahdheeb al Asma’ wal-Lughat 1/348

    Al-Mizzi
    Source: Tahdheeb al Kamal 11/462

    Al Dhahabi
    Source: Mizan al-I’tidal 1/415 - 1/110
























    http://www.ahlelbayt.com/articles/ha...y-of-knowledge < complete article



    Last edited by Abdullah Ali al Hanafi; 28-01-2008 at 09:24 PM.


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    jazakallahu khair brother for the information. In bangladesh i have heard this sentences for laymens, which is widespired by the shiete, and the most popular one is "ya ali madad". When i was child then i asked someone why the actor(in film) say this word when he fight against his enemy. Then someone says that ali was a strong man so people say that and got energy(la hawla waala kuaata illa billah.)


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    Quote Originally Posted by streetwalker View Post
    jazakallahu khair brother for the information. In bangladesh i have heard this sentences for laymens, which is widespired by the shiete, and the most popular one is "ya ali madad". When i was child then i asked someone why the actor(in film) say this word when he fight against his enemy. Then someone says that ali was a strong man so people say that and got energy(la hawla waala kuaata illa billah.)
    you will find this hadith on many Shia sites/forums/lectures etc , most sunnis are unaware and simply accept it without knowing its authenticity its a sad way that Shiites use Weak and Fabricated hadith from sunni books without mentioning its authenticity to make their points


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    salamu `alaykum

    This is true, but the hadith is actually hasan (sound) - though not rigorously authentic (sahih) nor a forgery (mawdu`). This was the verdict of many of the verifying scholars as well, including Ibn Hajar `Asqalani.

    Wasalam
    Salman
    Last edited by salman; 01-02-2008 at 11:47 PM.
    May My Soul be sacrificed for your soul, my beloved, my master Muhammad - peace and blessing upon you- !

    روحي لروحك الفداء يا حبيبي يا سيدي محمد


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    Salam,

    I seriously commend the ability of shia to misquote hadith and take out of context the meaning of it. This in turn shadows half the hadith and makes it look like Shia beliefs are more authentic than they are.

    The full hadith says:

    'I am the city of knowldege and Ali is the gate. Abu Bakr is the wall to building in the city, Umar is the foundation and Uthman the ceiling.'

    This is what Maulana Din of Birmingham Shariah council forwarded to me and I will get the reference for it and post it here as soon as he E-mails it to me.

    This is the saying of a learned, Qualified Maulana...'Shia often misquote and chop of hadith and cover over bits of it to make shia ism perfect'.

    I think that sums up this hadith as well.

    WS


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    If you could get the authenticity of that hadith 'Al Islam', it would be great.


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    Salam just an update as to what I discovered about this hadith

    In reference to the following Hadith:

    “I am the city of knowledge and Ali is its gate.”

    It was related by al-Hakim, at-Tabarani and others. It was also related by at-Tirmidhi with the wording, “I am the House of Wisdom, and Ali is its Door.”

    Albani declared the Hadith to be Mawdoo (fabricated). Daraqutni labeled the Hadith as mudtarib (shaky), both in isnad and text. Tirmidhi labeled it is ghareeb (weak) and munkar (rejected). Bukhari said that the Hadith has no sahih narration and declared it un-acknowledgeable. Qurtubi said about this Hadith in al-Jame’ li Ahkam al-Quran: “This Hadith is Batil (false)!” Ibn Maeen said that the Hadith is a baseless lie. Dhahabi considered it a forgery and included it in his book on forged Hadiths. Al-Hakim declared that it is weak. Amongst others who dismissed the Hadith are Abu Zur`ah, Abu Hatim, Yahya bin Saeed, etc.

    This Hadith is narrated by many unreliable chains. These Isnads (chains of transmission) were deemed to be unreliable because they contain Shia, liars, and people accused of lying. It should be noted that Ibn Hajar and some others differed and stated that because there were so many unreliable chains–and because the meaning of this Hadith is not invalid–that collectively these many unreliable chains could constitute a level of Hasan. However, we do not agree with this position and instead take the opinion of Bukhari and the many others who deemed that the weakness in the chains could not constitute anything but weakness or forgery.

    However, even those who accept this Hadith do not interpret the Hadith in the same manner that the Shia do. The Hadith refers to Ali as a gate to the city of knowledge; yet, this does not impart exclusivity nor does it convey superiority of Ali over Abu Bakr or Umar. The Prophet similarly praised other Sahabah and it is incorrect to take a close-minded and dogmatic approach to this Hadith. Abu’l Mu`in al-Nasafi says in Tabsirat al-Adilla: “This Hadith does not establish the superiority of Sayyiduna Ali (over Abu Bakr). ‘I’m the city of knowledge and Ali is its door.’ A city never has only door (unlike a fortress). Rather, most cities would have…one (door) from each side.”

    In another Hadith, the Prophet refers to Ali as his brother, and the Shia use this as a proof for the superiority of Ali over Abu Bakr. And yet, the Prophet similarly refers to Abu Bakr as his brother, and this is recorded in the Sahihayn! What the Shia need to understand (and Allah help them to understand this seemingly intuitive concept) is that these are not praises of exclusivity. A man can have many brothers, not just one! We direct the reader’s attention to the following Hadith:

    “Let no door of the Mosque remain open, except the door of Abu Bakr.”

    (Sahih Muslim, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 244)

    In this Hadith, the Prophet even uses an expression of exclusivity (i.e. let no door…), yet we Sunnis still do not interpret this literally. Instead, we understand that these are expressions of praise. The other doors of the Mosque were not closed, as it is clear that this is a saying and it is meant simply to praise Abu Bakr. Furthermore, this Hadith shows that there are many doors, not just one. In the case of the Hadith of the city of knowledge, this reference is not to be taken literally: it is obvious that the Prophet is not in actuality a city. In other words, this is a saying not to be taken literally; it is praise of Ali and cannot be construed in the sectarian manner that the Shia view it. The reader should be reminded that those scholars of Hadith who overlooked the weakness of the various chains of this Hadith did so on the condition that the meaning of the Hadith be interpreted in the manner above and not in the Shia manner.

    In conclusion, the Hadith was narrated by weak and unreliable narrators (i.e. Shia, liars, etc.). It was not narrated by even a single reliable chain. As such, we are inclined to reject it, as was the opinion of the impressive list of scholars we mentioned above. We therefore reject both versions of the Hadith (i.e. the City of Knowledge and the House of Knowledge…).
    http://www.ahlelbayt.com/articles/ha...y-of-knowledge


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    Despite the great care and precision of the hadith scholars, much of what they regarded as true was later proved to be spurious.. In his commentary on the collection of Muslim, al Nawawi wrote: “A number of scholars discovered many hadith’s in the collections of Muslim and Bukhari which do not fulfill the conditions of verification assumed by these men.” The collectors attach a greater weight to the trustworthiness of the narrators. Their criterion was certainly valuable, but it was not sufficient. In our opinion the criterion for hadith criticism’s as well as standard for materials concerning the prophet life, is the one which prophet himself gave. He said: “After I am gone differences will arise among you. Compare whatever is reported to be mine with the book of God; that which agrees therewith you may accept as having come from me; that which disagrees you will reject as fabrication.” The great men of Islam right from the very beginning observe this valid standard. It continues to be the standard of thinkers today. Ibn Khaldun wrote: “I do not believe any hadith or report of a companion of the prophet to be true which differs from the common sense meaning of the Quran, no matter how trustworthy the narrators may have been. It is not impossible that a narrator appears to be trustworthy though he may be moved by ulterior motive. If hadith’s were criticized for their textual contents as they were for the narrators who transmitted them, a great number would have been rejected. It is a recognized principle that a hadith could be declared spurious if it departs from the common sense meaning of the Quran from the recognized principles of Shariah, the rules of Logic, the evidence of sense, or any other self-evident truth.” This criterion given by prophet as well as ibn Khaldun, perfectly accords with modern scientific criticsm.

    True, after Muhammad’s death the Muslims differed, and they fabricated thousands of hadith’s and reports to support their various causes. From the day Abu Lu’lu’ah, the servant of Mughirah, killed ‘Umar ibn al Khattab’ and ‘Uthman ibn Affan’ assumed caliphate, the old pre-Islamic enmity of Banu-Hashim and Banu-Ummayah reappeared. When, upon the murder of Uthman, civil war broke out between the Muslims, Aishah fought against Ali and Ali’s supporters consolidated themselves into a party, the fabrication of Hadith’s spread to a point where “Ali ibn Abu Talib himself had to reject the practice and warn against it. He reportedly said: “We have no book and no writing to read except the Quran and this sheet which I have received from the Prophet of God in which he specified the duties prescribed by charity.” Apparently, this exhortation did not stop the hadith narrators from fabricating their stories either in support of a cause they advocated, or of a virtue or practice to which they exhorted the Muslims and which they thought would have more appeal if vested with prophetic authority. When Banu Ummayah firmly established themselves in power, their protagonists among their hadith narrators deprecated the prophetic traditions reported by the party of ‘Ali ibn Abu talib’ and the later defended these traditions and propagated them with all the means at their disposal. Undoubtedly thy also deprecated the traditions reported by ‘Aishah’, “Mother of the Faithful.”

    A humorous piece of reportage was given to us by ibn Asakir who wrote: “Abu Sa’d Isma’il ibn al Muthanna al Istrabadhi was giving a sermon one day in Damascus when a man stood up and asked him what he thought about the hadith of the prophet: “I am the city of knowledge and Ali is its gate.” Abu Sa’s pondered th question for a while and then replied: “Indeed! No one knows of this hadith except those who lived in the first century of Islam. What the Prophet had said was rather, I am the city of knowledge; Abu Bakr its foundation; Umar its walls; Uthman its ceiling; and Ali its Gate.” The audience was quite pleased with his reply and asked him to furnish them with the chain of narrators. Abu Sa’d could not furnish them with the chain of narrators and was embarrassed.” Thus hadith’s were fabricated for political and other purposes. This wanton multiplication alarmed the Muslims because many ran counter to the book of God. The attempts to stop this wave of fabrication under the Umawis did not succeed. When the Abbasids took over, and al Mamun assumed the caliphate almost two centuries after the death of the Prophet, the fabricated hadiths numbered in thousands and Hundred of thousands and contained an unimaginable account of contradiction and variety. It was then that the collectors applied themselves to the task of putting the hadiths together and biographers of the prophet wrote his Biography. Al Waqidi, ibn Hisham and Al mada’ini lived and wrote their books in the days of al Ma’mun. They could not afford to contradict the caliphate and hence could not apply with the precesion due to Prophet’s criterion that his traditions ought to be checked against the Quran and accepted only if they accorded therewith.

    Had this criterion, which does not differ from the modern and scientific criticism, been applied with precision, the ancient masters would have altered much of their writing. Circumstances of history imposed upon them the application of it to some of their writings and not to others. The later generation inherited their method of treating the biography of the prophet without questioning it. Had they been true to history they would have applied this criterion in general as well as in detail. No reported events disagreeing with the Quran would have been spared, and none would have been confirmed but those that agreed with the book of the God as well as the laws of nature. Even so, these hadiths would have subject to strict analysis and established with valid proofs and incontestable evidence. This stand was taken by the great Muslim scholars of the Past as well as of the present. The grand shaykh of Al Azhar, Muhammad Mustafa al Maraghi, wrote in his foreword to the book, The life of Muhammad by Haykal: “Muhammad- may God’s peace and blessing be on him – had only one irresistible miracle – the Quran. But it is not irrational. How eloquent is the verse of al Busayri: ‘God did not try us with anything irrational. Thus, we fell under neither doubt nor illusion.’”

    In his book, Al Islam wa al Nasraniyah, Muhammad Abduh, the great scholar and leader wrote: “Islam, therefore, and its demand for faith in God and his unity, depend only on the rational proof and common sense human thinking. Islam does not overwhelm the mind with the supernatural, confuse the understanding with the extraordinary, impose acquiescent silence by resorting to heavenly intervention, nor does it impede the movement of thought by any sudden cry of divinity. All the Muslims are agreed, except those hose opinions are insignificant, that faith in God is prior to faith in prophethood and that it is not possible to believe in the prophet except after one has come to believe in God. It is unreasonable to demand faith in God on the ground that the prophets or the revealed books has said so, for it is unreasonable to believe that any book has been revealed by God unless one already believed that God exists and that it is possible for him to reveal a Book and send a messenger.”
    http://www.islamawareness.net/Hadith...riticisms.html


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    Quote Originally Posted by al_islam View Post
    Salam just an update as to what I discovered about this hadith



    http://www.ahlelbayt.com/articles/ha...y-of-knowledge

    Asslamo Allaikum,

    Absolutely no disrespect intended but can we have the views of a "Muhaddith" on the issue instead of Shaykh Al-Albani (RA).

    With the greatest respect Br Salman is quoting Shaykh Ibnul- Haj'r Al-Asqalani (RA) & I can't take simply the words of Shaykh Al-Albani (RA) over that; anyone who is Madakhalee or Albani-Salafee; please feel free.


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    Default Re: Hadith About the City of Knowledge and Ali is its Gate

    Quote Originally Posted by Muadh_Khan View Post
    Asslamo Allaikum,

    Absolutely no disrespect intended but can we have the views of a "Muhaddith" on the issue instead of Shaykh Al-Albani (RA).

    With the greatest respect Br Salman is quoting Shaykh Ibnul- Haj'r Al-Asqalani (RA) & I can't take simply the words of Shaykh Al-Albani (RA) over that; anyone who is Madakhalee or Albani-Salafee; please feel free.

    Daraqutni labeled the Hadith as mudtarib (shaky), both in isnad and text.
    Tirmidhi labeled it is ghareeb (weak) and munkar (rejected).
    Bukhari said that the Hadith has no sahih narration and declared it un-acknowledgeable.
    Qurtubi said about this Hadith in al-Jame’ li Ahkam al-Quran: “This Hadith is Batil (false)!”
    Ibn Maeen said that the Hadith is a baseless lie.
    Dhahabi considered it a forgery and included it in his book on forged Hadiths.

    (http://www.ahlelbayt.com/articles/ha...y-of-knowledge)

    question bro Muadh , isnt Shaikh Albani a Scholar in Hadith?
    i hardly read any book by Albani but i heard he was a quite big scholar in Ahadith , not sure


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