ibn Kathir (RA) on Abu Mansur al Maturede (RA)

[Talib84]

Asslamau Alaikum

Part of a refutation of Darul Ulooms aqeeda:

The isnaad for this 'aqeedah only goes back to Abu Mansoor Al Maatureedee who was an Imaam of Kalaam, Ta'teel and Tahreef and as Dr.Shamsud Deen Al Afghaanee explained in his thesis and impressive research on the Maatureediyyah; that the facts point towards Abu Mansoor taking a large part of his beliefs from ibn Kullaab himself. And Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah and Ibnul Qayyim mentioned that he was a follower of Jahm ibn Safwaan.

So is the isnaad that leads back to Allaah equal to the isnaad that leads back to two of most evil individuals in the history of Islaam (i.e. Jahm ibn Safwaan and ibn Kullaab)?


Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah mentioned that this individual, Abu Mansoor Al Maatureedee was a follower of the Jahmiyyah (founded by Jahm ibn Safwaan), that evil sect that all of the 'Ulamaa of the past and the present declared to be disbelievers on account of their heresy.


I wish to present to you a great benefit from the rest of this evil isnaad and it is what some of the Scholars mention about Jahm ibn Safwaan: he took his belief from Ja'd ibn Dirham, and it is said that Ja'd took his innovation from Abaan bin Sam'aan, and Abaan took took it from Taaloot, the son of the sister of Labeed bin Al A'asam, and Taaloot took it from Labeed bin Al A'asam, the Jewish Magician, who performed magic upon the Prophet .

(See Ar Radd 'Alal Jahmiyyah of Imaam Ad Daarimee, Majmoo'ul Fataawa, Vol. 5 of Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah and Mawqif Ahlis Sunnah Min Ahlil Ahwaa wal Bid'ah, Vol.1)


Abu Mansoor Al Maatureedee, follower of Jahm ibn Safwaan: to Ja'd, to Abaan, to Taaloot, to Labeed, the evil Jew who performed magic on our beloved Prophet (see the tafseer of Suratul Falaq and Naas of Ibn Katheer )

Comments anyone?

[Colonel_Hardstone]

Asslamau Alaikum

Part of a refutation of Darul Ulooms aqeeda:

The isnaad for this 'aqeedah only goes back to Abu Mansoor Al Maatureedee who was an Imaam of Kalaam, Ta'teel and Tahreef and as Dr.Shamsud Deen Al Afghaanee explained in his thesis and impressive research on the Maatureediyyah; that the facts point towards Abu Mansoor taking a large part of his beliefs from ibn Kullaab himself. And Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah and Ibnul Qayyim mentioned that he was a follower of Jahm ibn Safwaan.

So is the isnaad that leads back to Allaah equal to the isnaad that leads back to two of most evil individuals in the history of Islaam (i.e. Jahm ibn Safwaan and ibn Kullaab)?

Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah mentioned that this individual, Abu Mansoor Al Maatureedee was a follower of the Jahmiyyah (founded by Jahm ibn Safwaan), that evil sect that all of the 'Ulamaa of the past and the present declared to be disbelievers on account of their heresy.


I wish to present to you a great benefit from the rest of this evil isnaad and it is what some of the Scholars mention about Jahm ibn Safwaan: he took his belief from Ja'd ibn Dirham, and it is said that Ja'd took his innovation from Abaan bin Sam'aan, and Abaan took took it from Taaloot, the son of the sister of Labeed bin Al A'asam, and Taaloot took it from Labeed bin Al A'asam, the Jewish Magician, who performed magic upon the Prophet .

(See Ar Radd 'Alal Jahmiyyah of Imaam Ad Daarimee, Majmoo'ul Fataawa, Vol. 5 of Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah and Mawqif Ahlis Sunnah Min Ahlil Ahwaa wal Bid'ah, Vol.1)


Abu Mansoor Al Maatureedee, follower of Jahm ibn Safwaan: to Ja'd, to Abaan, to Taaloot, to Labeed, the evil Jew who performed magic on our beloved Prophet (see the tafseer of Suratul Falaq and Naas of Ibn Katheer )

Comments anyone?

Asslamo Allaikum,

1) The bold text doesn't make any sense? Is there a typo?

2) Are you saying that your bold text (last Paragraph) is the statement of Ibn Katheer (RA)? As usual its probably that Ibn Katheer (RA) has named the Jew which did Magic and Ahlul-Hadeeth of India/Pakistan with their treachery have attributed the entire chain to Ibn Katheer and made it look like that Ibn Katheer is saying the whole thing.

3) Which Isnaad is this about?

4) http://www.sunnah.org/history/Scholars/al_maturidi.htm

Imam Abu Mansur al-Samarqandi al-Maturidi al-Hanafi (d. 333) was the student of Abu Nasr al-`Ayadi and Abu Bakr Ahmad al-Jawzajani.

5) Jahm ibn Safwān (died 128) was KILLED over a 100 years before Imam Mansur Maturidi (RA) came on the scene and Ahlus-Sunnah Wal Jamaah declare Jahmiyyah to be KAAFIR.

Please clarify the Isnaad and what this is about?

[Talib84]

Well I pasted that from a couple posts from this forum:

http://aa.trinimuslims.com/showthread.php?t=4857


dont even bother to join cause your post will be deleted and you will be banned.

[Colonel_Hardstone]

Well I pasted that from a couple posts from this forum:

http://aa.trinimuslims.com/showthread.php?t=4857


dont even bother to join cause your post will be deleted and you will be banned.

Asslamo Allaikum,

These are Madakhalees and I have been banned from many of their forums with the threads locked and my posts deleted.

As soon you reply to their childish babble, you get banned. Its fun while it lasts though.

On a serious note Imam Mansur Maturidi debated and refuted both the Matuzilla and Jahmiyya so the accusation that he was one of them is funny

[Sunni Muslim]

Dr.Shamsud Deen Al Afghaanee explained in his thesis and impressive research on the Maatureediyyah

Have a look at this and see what this man was on:

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7222

[Talib84]

Looks like they check out sunniforum too, only they refer to it by a different name