concerning the dying out of other madhabs

[callofthedeen]

I was wondering if anyone has any information regarding of the 'dying' out of other madhabs, because I read that scholars like Sufyan al Thawri was the founder of his own madhab. Mayb someone can help.

Jazakalah Khair

[Yahya]

It is because the chains are no longer Saheeh.

For example, if you want to study the Hanafi school, there are thousands of sheikhs you can study with. They are trustworthy transmitters of the school. They were taught by trustworthy transmitters of the school. And THEY were taught by trustworthy transmitters of the school... in an unbroken chain that stretches back to Abu Hanifah and the Saahibayn (rahimahumullah), going through the top scholars of the madhhab over the years. So, you can have certainty that you are receiving the teachings of the madhhab properly.

But, if you wanted to study the madhhab of Imam Layth, for example, you might find that there is no scholar whose chains that go back to Imam Layth are completely Saheeh. As a result, you would not be certain that you are being taught the madhhab properly. There would be doubt surrounding the authenticity of the teachings you are receiving.

This is why, several centuries ago, the scholars of the ummah agreed that only the Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i and Hanbali schools were still Saheeh, and the people had to make due with these four.

It's really interesting to look at. In some cases, the madhhab that died out was HUGE! The school of Imam al-Awzaa'e DOMINATED what is now Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and Palestine for a while. But once Imam ash-Shafi'i came along, those regions became Shafi'i instead. Meanwhile, a school like the Hanbali school, which has always been small, has continued until this very day.

[ENIGMA]

Very interesting topic. Nice info Brother Yahya.

[Ibn_Harith]

Ive heard you have some people who follow Ibn Hazm (ra) even nowadays, effectively making then dhahiri.

[Isa al-Maliki]

Assalaamualaikum,

Unfortunetly, it seems like the Hanbali madhab is starting to die out aswell.
It's being misrepresented and tampered with. What is important to take note of is that some scholars talked about the four madhahhib, but excluded the Hanbali madhab for another. Some of the great scholars of the past did not accept it as an authentic fiqhi madhab at all. Some of those close to the Dhahiri madhab these days are those who used to be associated with the Hanbali madhab, but went far in their deviation.

[Yahya]

Without doubt, the great and honorable Hanbali madhhab is being tampered with nowadays. Truly, the trustworthy transmitters of Hanbali fiqh are few. But they exist. The school is not dead yet.

And this wouldn't be the first time that the school was on the verge of dying out. Sheikh Abdul-Qadir al-Jilani, the great wali, was a big scholar of the Shafi'i school. But when he feared that the Hanbali school would die out, he switched schools. He learned the Hanbali school, followed it, and taught it. And by the mercy of Allah, he attracted a lot of students, and the Hanbali school had a resurgence. Perhaps a similar thing could happen nowadays.

Allahu 'A'lam

[Isa al-Maliki]

Yes, let's hope so, inshaAllah. Because i fear it might die out if nothing is done.

[callofthedeen]

Bismillahir Rahmaan ir Raheem

Jazakallah Khair brother for the information but I was wondering.

1) Does that mean views of these madhabs which were authentic that could be traced back to the Prophet died out? Meaning now noone knows about it. So wouldn't that mean with the dying out of these madhabs we lost certain practices that were traceable back to the Prophet?

2) And from what i have read, the Dhahiri Madhab rejected taqleed and consensus of people other the sahaba. Is that true?

[Nawawi619]

As Salamu Alaykum


There are many factors leading to why a particular school died out. Imam Zaid gave some really good reasons in his cd lecture "Why Muslims follow a madhhab."

One reason is that the school has not been updated and refined in an unbroken chain of successive scholars to the present day. We may have remnants of works from particular Imams or schools but because these surviving works have not been updated or refined or reevaluated by living scholars who belong to this school, we cannot know for certain what we have of these Imams or schools is in fact the original methodology and rulings it purports. In other words the surviving books of these madhhabs and scholars have not been transmitted to us by tawattur (successive unbroken chains of transmission of scholars from the school to the present day).

Secondly, some of these schools who died out , died out because they were replaced by superior more flexible schools. For example the madhhab of Imam Awza'i which was in egypt was gradually replaced by the school of Imam Shafii which many viewed to be a more superior school.


So the reason that the four madhhabs have continued to exist to this day was one they have been transmitted to us by tawattur (transmission in successive groups upon groups of scholars from the school to the present day) and two they were probably more superior and more flexible then the others. Third, unlike the four schools, the dead schools were not updated nor reevaluated by these succesive groups of scholars.

Wa Llahu Alim

[Yahya]

1) Does that mean views of these madhabs which were authentic that could be traced back to the Prophet died out? Meaning now noone knows about it. So wouldn't that mean with the dying out of these madhabs we lost certain practices that were traceable back to the Prophet?

wa'alaykumussalaam

It doesn't mean that no one knows about the judgments of those schools. There are living scholars who have studied over 30 madhhabs. But it means that there are chains that are not Saheeh. That's all. If a judgment is relayed to us with a weak chain, it doesn't mean that the judgment is wrong. And it doesn't mean that the judgment is lost. Rather, it means that there is doubt about it.