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Thread: Traditional Sunni Islamic Epistemology

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    Default Traditional Sunni Islamic Epistemology

    I have a question that has been bugging me for some time which no scholars are able to answer for me satisfactorly.

    This is based upon Ashari aqeedah:

    Unaided human reason cannot by itself figure out what is good and what is bad and how to follow Allah (SWT). Things are good or bad because Allah (SWT) makes them good or bad, not because our reason dictates it to be so. Allah (SWT) sent us Messengers to know what is good and what is bad and to tell us to believe in Him and follow Him, etc. If pure human reason alone could do this then Messengers would be unnecessary. This is why Imam al-Ghazali says that those unreached by the message or reached with a distorted message are not responsible.

    So what is the nature of belief? When the message reaches a person how does he accept it as the truth and become a Muslim? Someone may hear the full undistorted truth about Islam but still have doubts which prevent him from entering, while someone else may be wholly convinced on little "proof".

    Shaykh Nuh Keller once said that if Islam could be proved there would not be a single kaffir on the face of the earth. So how does one accept something unproved as true?

    I asked Shaykh Abu Qanit al-Hassani about this and his reply was:

    The acceptance of revelation is almost always due to the person
    realizing the conformity of what he hears with his "pre-programming"
    which took place before his birth (and is partly mentioned in verse
    7:172
    of the Qur'an)...

    > For example, someone hears the Qur'an, what lets him grasp Islam
    > in his heart? Now the Catholic Philosopher Blaise Pascal said that
    > there are 3 ways that you can believe something. You believe through
    > reason, inspiration, or habit.

    Another reason for belief is direct perception - this is why the Arabs
    say
    "al-`ayaanu yughni `ani l-burhaani" "Eye-witnessing frees one from
    needing detailed proofs". In English, you say "Seeing is believing."
    The actual and foremost reason for belief is perception. For the
    common
    man, it is a weak feeling in the heart which reminds him the truths
    which
    he learned before being born into this world - which he still carries
    along
    with him subconsciously. For the `arif and advanced spiritual, it is a
    constant and strong vision of the Divine Entity which fortifies and
    firmly
    established this belief in his heart...

    There is no "versus" here [concerning reason vs. revelation] if you want to give your heart rest, know
    that
    Allah knows the true nature of existence. And this true nature can be
    discovered in multiple ways (more than three ways). And that rational
    logic
    is a means to discover this reality. And Revelation from a true
    prophet
    is a way to discover this reality. And witnessing with one's eyes,
    ears, soul, dream body, or astral body is another way to verify this
    reality. And there other ways also, such extensive research into
    history and finding that all beliefs of all traditional people can be
    traced
    back to some ancient core teachings which agree with each other - and
    the differences we see today among the religions are due to improper
    preservation and adulterated conveyance away from the original
    teachings.
    He also said:

    Rejecting Islam due to fiqh has been the major reason for leaving Islam
    from the time of Abu Jahl to now. You should know that the real reason
    Abu Jahl never became Muslim was that he was afraid that the laws which
    Muhammad was bringing would infringe on his current "unfair" and
    "dishonest"
    business practices - as is recorded in some books of seerah...

    The truth will remain the truth regardless of whether we believe it or
    not. Belief is a choice which we are offered - a choice if made
    correctly
    will lead to eternal bliss and a choice which if made incorrectly will
    lead to eternal pain.

    qul al-haqqu min rabbika fa man sha'a ful yu'min wa man sha'a fa
    l-yakfur.
    inna a`tadna li l-dhalimina naaran ahata bihim saradiquha.

    "Say: The truth is from your Lord; so, whoever wants let him believe
    and
    whoever wants let him disbelieve. Indeed, We have prepared for the
    wrong-doers a Fire whose covering flames will engulf them."

    [{Surah Kahf, verse 29}]

    Yes. The individuated choice is real and if you understood the key to
    destiny,
    you would be among the scarce who understand how it works.
    So belief is a choice. Now here is where my problem comes in. I do not understand how belief is a choice. Knowledge of something requires that you are convinced it exists. For example a normal healthy person may believe that the computer monitor in front of him exists because of his senses, he can see it he can touch it etc. But a person that suffers from chronic hallucinations would take more convincing to realize the monitor does in fact exist.

    The same thing with Islam, this is what I do not understand, I cannot grasp this concept what so ever. Acceptance of Islam in the heart is based upon the heart being convinced of it's truth. This is belief, confirming that something is true. This doesn't seem like a choice to me. Some people may want to believe in Islam, and even chose it as their religion, but their hearts won't let them believe that it is true because they aren't CONVINCED.

    So basically I have asked Shaykh Abu Qanit al-Hassani, read Imam al-Ghazali's writings, listened to Shaykh Nuh's talks, and I still cannot grasp this concept.

    Allah (SWT) puts iman in the hearts of who he wishes, and put's kufr in the hearts of who he wishes. But there is also free-will for man to choice either. So belief is a choice and a gift? I am confused.

    Shaykh Abu Qanit al-Hassani said that most people will never understand the "key' to understanding divine decree and free-will, but he offers it anyway:
    <madrassa> Could you please clarify the two seeming contradictory statements
    +that are in the Quran when Allah (SWT) says that all evil comes from Me, as
    +well as evil comes from what your hands have earned. I was reading a book in
    +which the author was trying to clarify this by saying:
    <madrassa> That Allah created both good and evil and with him both were in
    +perfect harmony, and when he released them into this dunya evil got its shape
    +due to the distance from Him.
    <madrassa> Now is it true that if a person on a Path moves closer to Allah,
    +just because of his proximity, evil might have a lesser effect on him
    <madrassa> since there seems to be a proportional relationship between evil
    +and its distance from Allah (SWT)
    <madrassa> done
    <aq_hasani> ok
    <aq_hasani> We can see the line reasoning of the quoted author, but the contained
    +statement is not ...
    <aq_hasani> in full conformity to the actual truth of the matter.
    <aq_hasani> Firstly, we have answered a very similar question in our Previously Answered
    +Ihsan Section about there usually being *two* perspectives to each issue.
    <aq_hasani> One of these perspectives is called (all of these are considered synonyms
    +(for now)):
    <aq_hasani> shari`ah/farq/hikma
    <aq_hasani> The other perspective is called:
    <aq_hasani> haqiqah/jam`/qudra
    <aq_hasani> And it is only the advanced and completed spiritual [rajulun kaamil] who has
    +truly learned to join between the two.
    <aq_hasani> Farq states that everything in Allah's creation is separate in terms of
    +individuals being responsible for their own actions.
    <aq_hasani> Jam` states that everything is ultimately in the control of Allah.
    <aq_hasani> And the higher understanding here has to do with the key to undertanding
    +destiny - which is referred to as a secret by past scholars due the rarity of
    +the individual who possesses the key.
    <aq_hasani> Nevertheless, we will lay bare this key for you in a single statement, which
    +perhaps you may understand at a much later date:
    <aq_hasani> First the pre-requisite understanding...
    <aq_hasani> All responsibility returns to the concept of "consciousness".
    <aq_hasani> It is only because we are conscious of our actions and experience choice
    +that responsibility can be established.
    <aq_hasani> Once you understand this, then you are ready to receive the key:
    <aq_hasani> And again, we would not expect you to fully understand at this point.
    <aq_hasani> The Key: "Our consciousness is a subset *representation* of the Divine
    +consciousness."

    <aq_hasani> We do not want to go into detailed references and explanations in this
    +online lesson.
    <madrassa> i understand
    <aq_hasani> So, we ask you to use the Previously Asked Questions option...
    <aq_hasani> so we can send you some previous discussions about this.
    <aq_hasani> [We will also paste in part of the Previously Asked Ihsan Question]:
    <aq_hasani> One reason people are confused about this matter is that the Qur'an itself
    +quickly switches
    <aq_hasani> from the level of shari`ah to the level of haqiqah and vice versa (often in
    +the same verse).
    <aq_hasani> Thus, they are unable to understand what really is meant since the same
    +event is narrated
    <aq_hasani> from two opposite vantage points.
    <aq_hasani> An example of this in one verse is:
    <aq_hasani> And these villages We destroyed when they started doing wrong and We had
    +[already]
    <aq_hasani> appointed for their destruction a fixed date [maw`idan].
    <aq_hasani> [{Surah Kahf, verse 59}]
    <aq_hasani> Now the beginning part of the verse is talking on the level shari`ah - that
    +Allah brought
    <aq_hasani> punishment on people because of incorrect conscious choices that they were
    +making.
    <aq_hasani> And the second part of the verse is talking on the level of haqiqah - that
    +they were
    <aq_hasani> to be destroyed on a particular date as predestined for them.
    <aq_hasani> An example of this in two verses is:
    <aq_hasani> "...If good befalls them they say, 'This is from Allah.' And if bad
    <aq_hasani> befalls them, they say, 'This is from you [O Prophet].' Say: All
    <aq_hasani> is from Allah. So what is wrong with these people that they almost
    <aq_hasani> cannot understand [a simple] statement.
    <aq_hasani> If good befalls you, it is from Allah and if bad befalls you, it is
    +from
    <aq_hasani> yourself..."
    <aq_hasani> [{al-Nisa', verse(s) 78-79}]
    <aq_hasani> Now, clearly, if one were think on the same level, the verses above contain
    <aq_hasani> a contradiction - as many unqualified people (mostly non-Muslim) have
    +claimed.
    <aq_hasani> But, such passages in the Qur'an are written for the baqi who has learned
    +to join
    <aq_hasani> between the haqiqah and the shari`ah. Thus, he sees the shari`ah part of
    <aq_hasani> "if bad befalls you, it is from yourself" and he sees the haqiqah part of
    +"all is from Allah".
    <aq_hasani> The spiritually immature will not be able to grasp this.
    Can someone put this all together for me so I can grasp these concepts?

    Jazakallahu Khayrun


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    Heh, I just commented to someone that epistemology was mind-numbingly boring before I saw this thread..

    I've always been of the supposition that faith comes through understanding.. But I'll leave this for the time being to more qualified individuals as my personal views probably don't conform with the standard ones with regard to this (too much western/eastern philosophy, doh).


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    To make this question easier:

    How is belief a choice and not something soley dependent upon the mind's ability to accept knowledge?

    Is the basic question.


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    Ok well Shaykh Abu Qanit al-Hassani just sent me 3 very long emails which answer this issue, but they are extremely complicated. If you would like to read them, ask me.


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    In the Name of Allah, the Merciful, the Powerful

    Assalamu `Alaykum.

    Dear Honest Student,

    Sidi, you wrote:

    > I hate to bother you with so many questions but Abu Hanifa
    > said that if you are not sure about a question in aqidah, you
    > should ask a scholar immediately (or something like this, Allahu
    'Alam).

    This may come as a shock to you. But, the primary reason why
    we (on a personal level) answer questions is to advance in
    knowledge ourselves. We always re-verify what we say when producing
    references, and during this re-verification we almost always learn
    something new - such that at this point we are confident that we
    understand many issues to a level much higher than we were at
    just two or three years ago.

    And of course, there is the principle of sharing knowledge and
    saving people from doubts and wrong actions which will lead
    to Allah's anger.

    Nevertheless, as we are involved in various projects, no one
    should be offended if he/she does not receive a response or receives
    only a delayed response.

    > Ok so I think I understand this a little bit better now,
    > belief is a choice. Also the Guiding Helper says "30 Knowledge
    > is a firm conviction based upon evidence corresponding to reality
    > that something is true." I think I have confused the definitions
    > of knowledge and belief. Because I guess you DO NOT choose knowledge,
    > you must be convinced of it, but you DO choose belief.

    They are actually interlinked. If you believe something which
    corresponds to knowledge, then this belief is verified to be true.
    And if you believe something which does not correspond to knowledge,
    then this belief cannot be verified to be true (with the current
    information at hand).

    Also, this definition is not our own (as none of the words in the
    Explanatory Notes are our own), but is the definition used by
    the ancient Arabic mutakallimin for knowledge.

    Reference(s):
    Sharh Sullam al-Munawraqi by al-Damanhuri

    > You also define belief as "218 To believe something means to
    > recognize that it is true."

    See above.

    > I was listening to Shaykh Nuh Ha Mim Keller's lectures and
    > he said that if you could prove Islam there would not be
    > a single kaffir on the earth. He said the nature of Iman
    > is Taqlif (which he didn't translate).

    It is takleef - which means one is responsible for choosing the
    correct beliefs and actions as we mentioned before.

    As for not being able to prove belief, then we would state that
    the attributes of Allah are rationally provable while details
    of other tenets (e.g., the belief in the Messengers) are only
    rationally preponderant.

    Shaykh Nuh, along with many other contemporary scholars, is
    repeating the misconception introduced by Immanuel Kant
    which is prevalent in almost all people who have studied higher
    education in the West, (e.g., Shaykh Nuh who has a Phd. in
    Philosophy from some Universities in the US.) People who have
    degrees in Philosophy necessarily have been exposed to incorrect
    advanced belief constructs. And if they were not lucky enough
    to come across the handful or so (less than ten) of advanced
    mutakallimin alive today, they will assume that our past scholars
    had nothing to say about such advanced issues - as some of their
    ancient knowledge was not recorded in books.

    For example, we are confident that our time-space discontinuity
    proof is the first time that this proof has been written down
    in its entirety - although from research we are sure that the ancient
    mutakallimin knew this proof for it is the basis upon which the
    other rational arguments are founded. And we have actually
    used excerpts found in their ancient books to produce that
    proof.

    [One side note here is that there is a debate in philosophy about
    whether mathematics applies to the real world or not (This is
    an example of a kindergarten debate which goes on in the
    higher academic circles of the "qualified" West.) What we
    state here is that all mathematics is derived from two principles,
    that of order and that of addition - and these two principles are
    directly derivable from the *real* world. And if one accepts
    that numbers can be larger than others and that they can be
    ordered and added together, then there is no way out of rejecting
    the mathematical portions of that proof. The lop-sided nature
    of modern education (e.g., in Western Universities) produces
    people who speak about philosophical issues without having the
    necessary mathematical background around which these issues
    resolve.]

    The fact here is that after one proves that space and time is
    discontinuous and that time cannot be circular or backward flowing
    in nature, then there is no rational way to reject the proofs
    of the ancient mutakallimin who knew that space and time were
    arranged this way - as is evident form the traces of their
    writings.

    The reason why there are kuffar has less to do with rational logic than
    it has to do with people following their own desires and justifying
    their disbelief via "kindergarten" arguments.

    > He then spoke about how we do many things without requiring proof
    > such as walking into a building without asking for proof that it
    > will not fall on us.

    The proof for this is the certificate of occupancy which all
    civil governments issue after examining the structure of the
    building.

    But, yes there are many aspects of our belief (which are entrenched
    in the unseen) which cannot be possibly rationally proved (with our
    current limited information) - such as the fact that there are eight
    doors to Paradise and seven doors to Hell.

    > So must knowledge comes first before belief? Is this the meaning
    > of Imam al-Ghazali's statement about those who die without
    > da'wah having reached them or with a distorted version of
    > the da'wah?

    There is no necessary order here. But, we state that belief backed
    up with knowledge is *less* likely to be easily shaken.

    As for this entire issue of being granted amnesty, you should
    know that this is not agreed upon in the `Ash`ari school and
    here is what we forwarded as a conclusion after studying this
    issue:

    a) Since the `Ash`ari school states that the rational mind alone
    can reach the knowledge of the attributes of Allah, then
    no divine-message contact is necessary for the *intelligent*
    person who had an opportunity in life to ponder this issue
    for him to be responsible for not committing atheism,
    agnosticism,
    and pure-polytheism. Such an atheist, agnostic, or
    pure-polytheist
    is not granted amnesty.
    b) The only intelligent people who could possibly be granted
    amnesty
    are "conceptual" monotheists who have a vague idea about there
    being
    One All-Powerful Creator but have made major mistakes in the
    details of belief and laws. This is because the `Ash`ari school
    states that details of belief and law are *not* reachable
    by the intellect alone.

    The summary is very simple:

    a) One is responsible for believing in and acting on whatever
    one knows.

    Thus, if an intelligent person is alone in the jungle, then he is
    responsible for being a "conceptual" monotheist as that is reachable
    via pondering alone via various avenues. And such a person would
    not be responsible for knowing detailed tenets and laws which are
    only learned from a divinely-revealed primary text. For example,
    the person living in the jungle would not be responsible for knowing
    that he cannot eat pork meat, nor is it necessary for him to know
    that Allah has ordained five daily prayers on all humans. Nor is
    it necessary for him to know all of the details of beliefs mentioned
    in the Explanatory Notes of Song 3.

    Reference(s):
    [{al-Mayyarah Sharh, for Ibn `Ashir's Murshid, lines 21-28}]
    [{`Ilm al-Usul al-Fiqh, Abd al-Wahhab Khallaf, Section
    on Maturidi School.}]


    > Since knowledge is firm conviction based upon evidence, what
    > if the da'wah does not produce firm conviction based upon
    > evidence in the individual? His heart is not satisfied because
    > there is not enough evidence for him to accept Islam as the
    > absoulte truth. Is this included in "da'wah having not
    > reached them."

    There is no necessity for the da`wah to produce a firm conviction
    in the mind. If such were true then the kufr of the Quraysh would
    be justified as Muhammad's (May Allah bless him and give him peace)
    presentations did not produce such a firm conviction. But, the da`wah
    has to be clear enough and unbiased enough such that it appears as
    a definite possibility of the truth. And we do read that some of
    the kuffar of Quraysh used to listen to the Prophet (May Allah bless
    him and give him peace) surreptitious and *almost* be convinced of
    the truth; but, then when they drew away they affirmed their
    disbelief.

    > But those who receive the true undistorted message of Islam and
    > sit there and think about it and consider it possible to be
    > true but do not accept it because they do not want to follow
    > the fiqh are making the choice not to believe?

    Both people are committing disbelief; but, what we state is that
    the actual reason for the disbelief has often less to do with
    the actual tenets that some other issue, such as that of fiqh
    or that of being afraid of being outcast from society.

    > See my mistake was that I was looking at belief as NOT a choice.
    > The reason is to recognize something is true is not conciously
    > chosen. I used to think that belief was based upon being proven,
    > and you did not chose it.

    Now. You understand correctly that a belief is chosen. Yes. There
    is usually some knowledge proof behind the belief, but returns to
    the choice.

    > Can you please elaborate for me on the nature of how belief
    > is a CHOICE?

    There are three possibilities for each belief:

    a) Either you accept it as true
    b) You reject it as false
    c) You are inconclusive about it.

    For example, if someone walks up to you and says such-and-such famous
    scholar has uttered this statement. Then, you are presented with
    these three choices. Now, if you trust the source and the scholar,
    then you most probably will choose option (a) even though the
    actual statement of the scholar may be incorrect and not correspond
    to true knowledge.

    This is an example of how you chose a particular belief. And it is
    this
    exact method which almost all humans use to chose beliefs - and that
    is on the *basis of trust*.

    Now, Allah has been very merciful and He has not confined us to
    *only* trusting His messengers; but, rather has conveyed through them
    *actual* truths and realities which can - in many cases - be
    independently
    verified. And a point comes, where the person understands that the
    messenger is a reliable source and thus trusts all of his
    *authenticated*
    statements - even those for which only rational preponderance can
    be achieved or no rational statement can be issued.

    > And can you in more detail contrast the diference between
    > choice and knowledge?
    See above.


    > Also what are the proofs that Sayyidina Muhammad (SAWS) was a
    prophet, and
    > that his revelation is divine?

    This is a separate question and we will e-mail a previously asked
    question to you about this separately.

    > And what is the limit of proofs?

    The limit of proofs is based upon trusted perception.

    > Why is it that belief is not (fully) based upon proofs?

    We explain this in the excerpt which we will e-mail you
    separately.


    Wassalamu `alaykum wa rahmatullah

    Abuqanit Hasani
    Main Author
    Guiding Helper Foundation

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    Next email is the rational proofs that Sayyidina Muhammad (SAWS) was a Messenger.


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    Rational proofs that Sayyidina Muhammad (SAWS) was a Messenger:

    In the Name of Allah, the Merciful, the Powerful

    Assalamu `Alaykum.

    Dear Honest Student,

    Sidi,

    Here is a copy of one of our lesson trascipts with a completed
    student of ours Harun al-Bostanian. It addresses your questions
    about whether it is rationally provable that that Muhammad (May Allah
    bless him and give him peace) was a messenger and why all beliefs
    do not have proofs behind them.

    Harun wrote:

    > This leads to another 'difficult question' however.
    > a) Allah is the ultimate source of knowledge
    > b) Allah uses secondary causes (i.e. An angel is in charge of the
    rain,
    > Gabriel teaches the Qur'an to Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)etc.)
    > c) The knowledge that Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)had was not possibley
    > obtainable by a learned man, let alone an uneducated man, so it must
    have
    > come from a source with more knowledge than humans
    > d) isn't it possible that another being (time-bound, created, but
    more
    > knowleadgeable than humans) taught him the Qur'an (i.e. like people
    > hear angels etc.) ? I know that some people at the time of the
    Prophet
    > (pbuh) accused him of being possessed by Jinn (he (pbuh) even worried
    > about this after the first revelation.)

    We first place the "sought after" answer in the "statements" category.

    Then, we place it in the Din category (level 1).

    Then, we place it in the `Aqidah category (this is the second level).

    Then, we see that there are two subcategories here:

    i) Tenets which can be derived purely rationally
    ii) Tenets which can only derived with the aid of Divine
    Revelation. [It is not that rationality does not play
    a part in deriving these tenets; but, rationality alone is
    not enough to derive them accurately].

    We wrote before concerning this:

    Next, we must learn a general rule for placing each tenet
    into one of the above two categories. One such rule
    is "trial and error" - in which we first attempt to derive the
    tenet rationally and upon failing consign it to the
    Divinely-Revealed category. This method would be used
    by non-erudite people or beginners.

    The erudite would know a general rule at each level for
    placing the question into the appropriate category. And
    the general rule here is to see whether or not the tenet is
    about an unseen arbitrary detail (e.g., in Allah's metaphysical
    creation). If the tenet is about an unseen *arbitrary* detail
    concerning Allah's creation (e.g., the depth of the Hellfire
    or the number of doors to Paradise (e.g., 8)), then it cannot
    be figured out rationally. If the tenet is about an absolute
    affair which is not arbitrary (such as the Oneness of Allah),
    then it can be figured out rationally.

    Now for the purposes of demonstrating the "trial and error" method,
    we will attempt to prove that Prophet Muhammad learned the Qur'an
    from an Angel and not from another time-bound being such as a Jinn.

    Thus, for now, we will place your question into category (i)
    (level 3).

    Now, we will attempt to build a rational argument to prove
    that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and give him peace) was
    in contact with an Angel and not a Jinn (or other being who can
    lie (be dishonest).

    Now remember that all premises in a rational argument must return
    either immediately or reflectively to one of the six reliable
    sources of information mentioned in footnote 26 of the Notes
    of Sources. If we cannot show that these premises return to
    one or more of these sources, then the conclusion cannot be
    claimed to be rationally necessary.

    Start Proof:

    a) Angels are beings which can only tell the truth and can
    only perform actions which Allah commands them.
    b) Conscious beings who are not angels (e.g., jinn and humans)
    have the ability to go against Allah's apparent/external
    command.
    c) If the Prophet received his information from an Angel,
    we can be sure that it is an accurate representation
    of what Allah wanted to convey.
    d) If the Prophet received his information from a non-Angel,
    we cannot be sure that it is an accurate representation
    of what Allah wanted to convey (again in His external
    or apparent command).
    e) Since Allah would want to ensure trust and reliability,
    He would choose an angel and not a non-angel to convey
    His message.
    f) Since we know that the Qur'an could not have been produced
    by a time-bound being due to its accuracy and expansiveness,
    we conclude that it must have been produced by Allah.
    g) Since we know that the accuracy of the Qur'an is
    unblemished and all previous and current attacks
    against its accuracy can easily be proven wrong, this
    proves that the Qur'an actually contains the words which
    Allah wanted to convey - as Allah's knowledge is only
    accurate.
    h) Since (g) is true, it is most likely that an Angel
    conveyed the Qur'an to Prophet Muhammad (May Allah bless
    him and give him peace) and not a being who is prone
    to lie (be dishonest).

    Now we will examine this proof with the measure of footnote 26 of the
    Notes of Sources.

    Statement (a) needs empirical evidence in order for us to accept it.
    What this means is that we have to capture an angel and dissect its
    mental capacity and find out how it actually works. And after such
    as examination, we could probably see that an angel was not much
    different than a computer programmed with artificial intelligence
    (with the exception of consciousness).

    As this method of verifying statement (a) is a long shot, we conclude
    that we will probably not be able to verify the truth of statement (a)
    this way.

    Thus, we search for other ways. One way would be to collect mutawatir
    transmissions from angels which show that all of their statements are
    honest and no lies are issued from them. Even if we were able to do
    this, that still wouldn't prove that angels *could not* lie as the
    mere fact that no lie is recorded will not serve as sufficient evidence
    that no lie is possible - again until we examine their mental
    capacities and realize that their knowledge, statements, and actions
    is "programmed" by Allah and as such "lies" cannot be manifested by
    them.

    Thus, we conclude that statement (a) is not a sufficient base for
    a rational statement until a dissection and study is done on the
    angel species.

    Now moving on to statement (b). It can be proven via mutawatir
    reports (mostly in the East where people are "into" this stuff) that
    jinns can both lie and tell the truth. The same is true for humans.
    Thus, we conclude that statement (b) *is* rational.

    The rationality of (c) depends on whether we are able to prove
    if (a) is rational or not.

    (d) is rational since it is based upon (b), which is verifiable.

    (e) has nothing to do with rationality (by the strict definition
    of the term). Rather, our stating that Allah would want to ensure
    reliability in his transmission assumes that He wants what is
    best for us. And as explained in lines 51-52 of al-Jawharah
    al-Tawhid, His wanting what is best for us is not rationally
    verifiable or necessary.

    (f) is rational; but, it requires a long proof which ties into
    why a time-bound being cannot issue such words and such words
    can only issue from a being who is independent of time. As a side
    note, another way to prove that the Qur'an cannot issue from a
    time-bound being would be to show that its mere mathematical
    complexity goes beyond what a time-bound being can construct
    [We are not talking about about the arrangements of the words,
    letters used, topics discussed, language styles employed, rhetoric
    techniques used successively in a way which goes beyond the
    capacities of a time-bound being who can only experience linear
    thought, etc.)].

    (g) is internally inconsistent - even if it is rationally provable
    that there are *no* errors in the statements of the Qur'an. The
    inconsistency is that there is no link between its being accurate
    and it being *revealed* by Allah to the Prophet (May Allah bless
    him and give him peace). This is because Allah manifests accuracy
    at the hands of people who have not had anything revealed to them.
    For example, the following statements can be said to be accurate
    but are not revealed:

    * All matter is made up of distinct building blocks.
    * A rainbow consists of multiple colors of successively
    increasing/decreasing wavelengths.
    * When an opaque layer covers the human eye, no light
    reached the retina.

    Thus, a collection of such accurate statements does not necessarily
    indicate that they are revealed from Allah.

    O.K. So, we failed (albeit on purpose) but we'll try again:

    TRY #2:

    a) Angels are beings which can only tell the truth and can
    only perform actions which Allah commands them.
    b) Conscious beings who are not angels (e.g., jinn and humans)
    have the ability to go against Allah's apparent/external
    command.
    c) If the Prophet received his information from an Angel,
    we can be sure that it is an accurate representation
    of what Allah wanted to convey.
    d) If the Prophet received his information from a non-Angel,
    we cannot be sure that it is an accurate representation
    of what Allah wanted to convey (again in His external
    or apparent command).
    e) Since we know that the Qur'an could not have been produced
    by a time-bound being due to its accuracy and expansiveness,
    we conclude that it must have been produced by Allah.
    f) Since we know from mutawatir transmission that the Prophet
    reviewed and finalized each and every verse of the Qur'an,
    that proves that the entire Qur'an is traceable back to
    the Prophet (May Allah bless him and give him peace). Due
    what we note in (e) - and due to knowing that the Prophet
    was an illiterate man - and due to knowing that he did not
    have any "scholar" contacts (again by mutawatir transmission
    - as a side note, the claim that the Monk Buhayra taught him
    does not hold ground after learning that he did not really
    spend time with him and also knowing the great span of time
    between that event and the start of his prophethood), we
    conclude that the Prophet must have learned each surah of the
    Qur'an from a "spiritual" means.
    g) Now in view of premises (a) and (b), we give preponderance
    . to the fact that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and give
    him peace) learned the Qur'an from an angel.

    Now, this proof has potential to be a rational proof. However
    as we mentioned before, premises (a), (b), and (e) need long
    digressions or extensive research to prove why they are actually
    rational beliefs.

    However, even if (a), (b), and (e) can be rationally proven, we
    will only be able to give *preponderance* to the fact that the
    Prophet learned the Qur'an from an angel and not from a jinn.
    This is because it is contingently possible that the Jinn read
    the Preserved Tablet and accurately conveyed the information in
    it.

    The only *rational* conclusion we can reach using this approach
    is that the Qur'an again was received from some divine/spiritual
    source.

    And unless we can prove something rationally, we are forced to
    group the issue into the category of `aqidah of arbitrary facts.

    Thus, after we have failed with this trial and error method.
    We go back to level 3 and place the original question into
    category (ii) (arbitrary beliefs).

    Now it is quite easy according to the first injunction A, which
    we gave previously for this category to show that the Qur'an
    was revealed by an angel.

    Surah 26, Verse 193

    nazala bihi r-ruhu l-amin

    The trustworthy angel (this is one meaning of ruh according to
    Fayrozabadi in Classical Arabic) came down with it (i.e. the
    Qur'an).

    Thus, we can prove rationally that the entire Qur'an was
    learned through some spiritual/divine means by the Prophet
    Muhammad. But, we can only give rational preponderance to
    the belief that this spiritual/divine means was an angel.

    Now this brings us to a point which the erudite know about,
    which was hinted at in the injunction for aqidah (level 2):

    a) Allah has on purpose obscured necessary premises for
    rationally concluding the details of the `aqidah we
    are asked to believe in. This is hinted at in many
    places of the Qur'an, such as:

    "And they say why was not an angel sent down (in front
    of us)? If We had sent down an angel, then the issue
    would have been decided and they would not be given
    this time (in the world) to tarry." [6:8]

    "Say: If I had [the proofs] which you are asking for,
    the issue would have been decided between you and me.
    And Allah is best-aware of the wrong-doers." [6:58]

    He has done this to see how many of His servants can trust
    their heart over their senses - as all rationality returns
    to sensory perception.

    It is quite easy to believe one's senses as this is the first
    conscious perception that we have as babies. It is part of
    the test to trust one's heart which vaguely recalls the first
    meeting with Allah mentioned in verse 172 of surah 7:

    "And when we took from [Adam] the [souls of the] Children of
    Adam who would come later [dhuhuri-] and made them witness
    against themselves asking, 'Am I not your Lord?' And they
    replied, 'Of course, we witness [that you are our Lord]'.
    And then we said, 'We did thus so that you would not claim
    on the Day of Resurrection that you were unaware of such.' "

    Thus, the erudite know the following:

    a) The beliefs mentioned in Song 2 of the Guiding Helper can
    be rationally proven (somehow or the other).
    b) The beliefs mentioned in Song 3 of the Guiding Helper are
    mostly arbitrary details which if Allah willed would have
    been different.

    Now, we have reviewed the proofs given by certain previous scholars
    for the beliefs in Song 3, but we have found the premises falling short
    of the requirements for a rationally necessary statement as outlined
    in footnote 26 of the Notes of Sources. And this returns to what
    `Abd al-Rahman al-Akhdari notes in his matn al-Sullam al-Munawraqi
    that logical proofs are of various types and of various levels -
    the highest of which is called a "burhaan" which has premises which
    return to one of the six reliable sources of information.

    And in any of this, you are free to challenge anything we say (for
    purposes of learning). For example, you may attempt to give a
    rational proof why there must be angels or why Allah sent down
    books or why the dead will in fact be resurrected, etc.

    End Lesson Transcript

    Wassalamu `alaykum wa rahmatullah

    Abuqanit Hasani
    Main Author
    Guiding Helper Foundation

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  9. #7
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    Shaykh Abu Qanit al-Hassani's comments on the rational proofs that Sayyidina Muhammad (SAWS) is a Messenger:

    In the Name of Allah, the Merciful, the Powerful

    Assalamu `Alaykum.

    Dear Honest Student,

    Sidi,

    Here is a supplement to the lesson which we sent you seraptely:

    Harun al-Bostanian wrote:

    > a)We have concluded that the complexity and accuracy of subjects in
    > the Quran could not have been learned from scratch in a lifetime
    > (esp. 1400+ years ago) by an uneducated man. Therefor, this
    > information must have come from a more knowledgeable source, a being
    > more knowledgeable than a human.

    Right. This is done via mutawatirat, mujarrabat, and hadasiyyat.

    > b) If I write "red is green." Due to our rationally neccessary
    > conclusion that Allah exists, and that He is the ultimate creator of
    > everything, we know that he is the creator of those words and the
    > medium (keyboard, computer, etc.) through which they came to be, and
    > of my action of typing them, and in his forknowledge, he knew I would
    > write them, etc.

    Yes. It is rationally provable that Allah is the ultimate creator
    and the continuous subsequent creator (via the Cosmological proof
    coupled with the spacial-temporal discontinuity proof).

    At this point, it is important to emphasize, that in order to
    understand that this above statement is rationally necessary, one must
    not have any preconceived notions of who Allah is. Rather, Allah is
    simply the *name* we've been taught for the Being Who necessarily
    exists, Who is beginningless, Who is permanent, Who is one, Who is
    independent, is different from His creation, has
    power/volition/knowledge/life, and has the ability to perform or leave
    undone any contingent action.

    And the fact that this being exists, is beginningless, is permanent, is
    one, is independent, is different from His creation, has
    power/volition/knowledge/life, and has the ability to perform or leave
    undone any contingent action is *figured out* step-by-step from
    *scratch* (meaning using one of the six reliable sources for
    a premise) using rational logic.

    > c) If it is possible for Allah to create a being more
    > complex/knowledgeable than a human, it is possible that
    > such a being (if it existed) could write something which
    > would go beyond the capacity for a human to write, and
    > deliver it to a Human. We would still be forced to conclude
    > that Allah created the being, its actions, etc. but we would
    > attribute the text it wrote to it(the being) on a hikmah
    > (or shari'a?) level and to Allah on a Qudrah (or haqiqah?)
    > level.

    [As a side note, first we would like to say that hikama can
    be used synonymously with shari`ah and that qudrah can be
    used synonymously with haqiqah - even if hikam-qudrah and
    shari`ah-haqiqah have different connotations.]

    >d) The text of the Quran, Muhammad himself, and the scholars of the
    > Ummah, all claim that the Quran is both on a hikmah and qudrah level
    > 'written' by Allah. In other words, it is not admixed with the
    > will/intention of a timebound being (like my statement 'red is
    > green,' or from a possible being more complex than humans.)

    High-level scholars are honest with themselves and do not stick
    dogmatically to some beliefs or writings that have been handed
    down just because some religious authorities have stated these
    beliefs/writings.
    [As a side note, the high-level scholars can remain safe while
    doing this (remaining safe means not incurring Allah's anger
    and deserving the Hellfire) while the non-astute people are
    prone to falling into Allah's anger and into His Hellfire with
    their rejection of such beliefs which they do not understand.
    The reason for this is that the high-level scholar has figured out
    the following base injunctions of knowledge (level 0 - concerning
    statements):

    A) All statements are made up of linked subjects and predicates
    (a subject is a visualization of an object which can
    be described and a predicate is a visualization of
    a quality which can describe that object).
    B) Statements are of two types: those that are internally
    consistent and those that have a contradiction built
    within them (e.g., It is a circle-square).
    C) Statements that are internally inconsistent can be
    discarded as false.
    D) Statements that are internally consistent can either be
    true or false (e.g., Harun is a man who lives on earth).
    E) If the statement is true, there is no reason to be
    afraid of it since Allah made it that way.
    If the statement is false, there is no reason to be
    afraid of it since Allah made it that way.

    In other words, the high-level scholars are never challenging
    Allah in any of their beliefs - and thus remain safe with Him.
    But, they are honest in their pursuit of knowledge and admit
    when they don't enough premises to build the argument or when
    they are aware that a contradiction or paradox situation has
    arisen which prevents them from going further].

    Now, Harun, we ourselves are constantly increasing in knowledge
    and after studying this subject in detail (after your recent
    inquiry), we have come to a paradox situation which prevents
    us to from going further.

    Now, we (personally) have always trusted the scholars (without
    even asking many questions) from the start of the matter and
    that is the reason why we were able to master such a large number
    of subjects of din in such a short time (since we did not expend
    time researching the veracity of each and every statement we
    learned from the previous and current scholars). [Of course,
    what we are doing now with you has a different purpose -
    and that purpose is to make you among the top ten `aqidah
    scholars alive.]

    And in this subject, we trusted the previous scholars who have
    written about the I`jaaz (inimitability) of the Qur'an, such as
    al-Zamakhshari (in his tafsir al-Kash-shaaf), al-Jurjani (in his
    book Dala'il al-I`jaaz wa asraar al-balaaghah), al-Qadi al-Baqalani
    (in his book I`jaaz al-Qur'an), Qadi `Iyaad (in his book also called
    I`jaaz al-Qur'an), and the more recent scholar al-Rafi`i.

    But after studying this further, there is paradox we are faced
    with:

    a) The arguments of inimitability search for a "code" that
    is behind the writing of the Qur'an which is so complex
    that nothing produced by humans even resembles it or comes
    close to it. This is the crux of all the arguments given.
    This code could be a code of eloquence (such as balagha).
    a code of language style, a code of word arrangement, a
    code of letter values, a code of conveying previously unknown
    scientific facts, a code of letter shapes, a code of letter
    sounds, a code of letter meanings, a code of word meanings,
    a code of successive statements, a code of successive paragraphs,
    a code of successive surahs, a code of successive narration
    of events, a hidden embedded code (which can only be found
    when one goes beyond the external meaning), a spiritual
    code which finds the links between the recitation of the
    Qur'an's letters and words and the occurrence of spiritual
    events (or even physical events brought about by spiritual
    links), a code of prophecies of the future, a code of
    accurately conveying history, a code of speaking about
    too many subjects for single man to master, a code of expert
    legislation, etc.
    b) If it is possible for a time-bound being to discover the
    true hidden code behind the Qur'an, then that proves that
    this true hidden code is intelligible to this time-bound
    being.
    c) But if the code is intelligible to a time-bound being, then
    it is contingently possible that a *time-bound* being
    actually embedded this code (again on a hikma level).
    d) Thus, if we were to discover the true hidden code which
    makes the Qur'an inimitable, that would prove that a
    time-bound being could have produced it.

    Thus, this is the paradox (or dilemma with this approach). If
    we actually find the true code which makes the Qur'an inimitable,
    then our finding this code proves that a time-bound being could
    have produced it.

    We (personally) are always honest with ourselves and this paradox
    is the honest conclusion one comes to after examining this approach.

    Thus, the codes of inimitability given by the previous scholars can
    again only act as a rational means of proving (via induction) that the
    Prophet Muhammad (May Allah bless him and give him peace) who was an
    unlearned illiterate man could not have possibly produced it
    without some sort of divine/spiritual source 1400 years ago.

    These codes can give preponderance of evidence that even a more
    advanced time-bound being would have trouble producing the Qur'an
    (again on a hikma level), but they cannot establish concretely that
    the Qur'an is not a production of a time-bound being - as the mere
    fact that the codes are intelligible to time-bound beings proves
    that they could have been produced by such time-bound beings.

    Thus, we conclude that the true code which Allah has embedded
    in the Qur'an which makes it inimitable - mentioned in the verse:

    Say: If the humans and jinn were to gather together to produce
    something similar to this Qur'an, they would not be able to
    produce something similar to it even if they were to help each
    other.
    [al-Qur'an 17:88]

    - is *undiscoverable* by time-bound beings. We would have a theory
    that the code has something to do with timelessness or
    time-independence as the only being who could understand such a
    code would be the Beginningless and Endless One.

    [Now, we understand why Allah did not give tawfiq to that man
    named Rashid Khalifah in his claim that the number nineteen
    is the true hidden code behind the Qur'an using the values of
    letters and numbers of words/verses/surahs as a base for his
    argument. As if it were that simple, then there is no reason
    why a time-bound being could not have produced it (e.g., with
    the aid of a computer). As a side note, someone entered his
    residence and stabbed him nineteen times to death - what an
    awful journey's end.]

    Now this does not mean that that the minor codes discovered
    by the scholars over the ages (some of which we have mentioned
    above in premise (a)) have no value. Rather, those codes taken
    together with common human experience help us to inductively
    conclude that the Prophet Muhammad must have had some
    divine/spiritual source.

    But, your question about what prevents a more-advanced time-bound
    being from producing the Qur'an cannot be adequately answered
    using a rational logical argument - since again as soon as we
    find the hidden code it serves as a proof that a time-bound being
    could have produced it.

    Thus, our previous stated method about examining all time-bound beings,
    analyzing their capabilities, and showing that their capabilities fall
    short of the content of the Qur'an cannot prove rationally that the
    Qur'an was not produced by a time-bound being - as we will be unable
    to come up with an intelligible code which no time-bound being could
    replicate.

    Thus, our previous statements need to be qualified. And the
    qualification is that our method will only give *preponderance*
    of evidence that the Qur'an could not be the production of a
    time-bound being.

    >
    > How do we prove d)? Regardless of who delivered the message to
    > Muhammad, how do we prove that what was delivered is directly Allah's
    > words, and not admixed with another being's.

    We can prove that the Qur'an does not have any words added or
    subtracted from its original source.

    The way we can prove that the Qur'an does not have words admixed
    with it from its original source is something called a security
    watermark (this is used by humans in the computer age and is also
    enters into encryption).

    This method calls for embedding a certain discernable code within the
    verses and letters which will be noticeably destroyed even if a single
    letter/word is removed or altered. There are methods to check and
    verify if the security watermark is still intact or not.

    We are almost sure that Allah has put such a security watermark
    in the verses of the Qur'an. This is our theory, which someone
    would have to prove.

    But again as soon as someone discovers the "security watermark
    code", it can no longer serve as a means to rationally prove that
    a time-bound being could not have produced it and this is the
    paradox or "brick wall" we are faced with in answering your
    question.

    Now we mentioned at the beginning of this training that our method
    will allow you to answer any question that you have, but the
    answers may be a finite set of choices.

    Thus the question was: Rationally speaking, could an advanced
    time-bound being have produced the Qur'an?

    The answer is: Human rational logic allows the following two
    possibilities:

    a) The Qur'an was produced by Allah
    b) The Qur'an was produced by an advanced time-bound being
    who ultimately is the creation of Allah.

    As for the ruling of believing that a time-bound being produced
    the Qur'an, it is that the person who hold this view has exited
    the sphere of Islam as it is point (t) of the 21 acts listed in
    Ibn Juzayy al-Kalbi's list. And this ruling is taken from verses
    in the Qur'an which clearly state or imply such.

    Thus, the proper place of this question should be in the "Arbitrary
    Beliefs" section of `Aqidah. And if we place it there, then it is
    quite easy to obtain a single cohesive answer using verses from the
    Qur'an and statements from hadith.


    Wassalamu `alaykum wa rahmatullah

    Abuqanit Hasani
    Main Author
    Guiding Helper Foundation

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  10. #8
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    Shaykh Abu Qanit al-Hassani clarified conceptual monotheist for me:

    In the Name of Allah, the Merciful, the Powerful

    Assalamu `Alaykum.

    Dear Honest Student,

    Sidi,

    We have to attend to other issues here, but as a clarification, we
    would consider the people of fatrah (at least most of them) to
    be conceptual monotheists.

    So, you are perhaps not understanding who a conceptual monotheist is.
    A conceptual monotheist is a person if you were to ask them "Who
    created
    the heavens and the earth", they would say "Allah." This is explicitly
    mentioned in the Qur'an in several verses which speak about the
    Arabian Jahiliyyah Pagan Polytheists.

    And this was the exact belief of the people of fatrah including all
    of the Prophet's ancestors.

    Second issue about where we derived the conclusion about amnesty from.
    No. It is not from the Maturidi school. It is actual one of two
    opinions in the `Ash`ari school and the opinion which if you ponder
    yourself is more consistent with the school in general. And is
    considered
    by many to be the stronger opinion. It is also the opinion of
    Imam Ibn `Ashir himself - this is the reason why you will see that in
    his orginal Murshid, he did not mention the necessity of having the
    divine message reach one, to be responsible - and he accurately
    mentioned
    the other two prerequisites for responsibility which we have noted in
    the Explanatory Notes for Song 1.

    The Maturidis are saying something totally different, that specific
    laws are understandable via the intellect and that isolated people
    would
    be responsible for the "larger" laws such as the unlawfulness of
    fornication, wine, and homicide.

    Reference(s):
    Sharh Mayyarah for Murshid, verse 10-13


    Wassalamu `alaykum wa rahmatullah

    Abuqanit Hasani
    Main Author
    Guiding Helper Foundation

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  11. #9
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    Ok... now the question is, what about false things that aren't revelation. For example a false Prophet or a false revelation. Couldn't the mind also find those to be "logically possible" or not?


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