Thanx for ur kind explanations. But i have more doubts now as an abstract i can say that if one satisfies himself @ TJ pattren then he simply is escaping the real responsibilities that u explained and throw out at the shoulders of some "RESPONSIBLE" who r they??? while satisfiying hoimself that he is doing fine calm and quite no threat to his life and what so ever concerns.
And what about Rasulullah SAW u said he deliver HAQ and leave the rest to ALLAH!!. I m afraid that its not true, He scarifies his entire life to implement this ALLAH's System (This is absolute logical how can ALLAH's system bare that it should be suppressed by any man made system like Secular Approach i.e Lock ALLAH into Mosque / Mandar / Church we will pray him there but Out of these premises we r our self sovereignand the followers just keep on conveying good talks to the masses and think that what have done our duty to ALLAH.
OUR BELOVED RASOOLLAH SAW never preaches like that after Hijira (Yes this type of tabligh was carried out in Makkah where the QURAN didnt give permission to actively resist), But after that He always strive to encounter the actual dominant forces at that time to implement the real DEEN (Soco economic political) System. U can read the history He himself engages and forced to drive the Mushrikeen e MAKKAH into the armed confliction as no advancement of any sort has been attempted by the Mushrikeen themselves firstly on to MADINA, so why RASOOULLAH SAW had not just sit back and do this sort of preaching in MADINA??QURAN also mentions it hundred times that whatever rule or environment who make it difficult for a muslim to follow the commandment will be the FITNA. And fight against it until u restore the ALLAH's commandment over it!!.
What about the JIHAD / QITAAL which is present in half of the QURAN teachings, Against what??? We are not beaten or even threatened by anyone in doing this sort of preaching of good deeds (Just go to Mosque pray and dont look at the bilboards and listen to the up beating songs in the neighborhood). So are we conforming what QURAN teaches (Life Sacrifices)?? We are looking the LAWS OF ALLAH at the peoples feet in this system, but do nothing actively against them by trowing out the responsibility upon some one "RESPONSIBLE". Of course i m not saying for standing up actively against such an organized system of KUFR, but somehow this should clarify at least in the menifesto i.e if we are strengthen up to so and so number level then we will actively engaged in the field against these munkiraats. But nothing is like that in TJ's draft? Our Beloved RASOOULLAH has never send any kind of preacher to any of the surroundings even after the fatah Makkah. He rather sends his forces/Mujahideens to implement the ALLAH's SYSTEM and yes after that implementation the non muslim people themselves attracted towards the ISLAMIC teachings. Munafqeen at that time also sincerely advices the muslims against JIHAD/QITAAL by saying that why r u confronting with those Musriks we should deal them with humbly senseably and should not fight etc. (Extreme Life love)
As for as ur scho economic political system explanation is concerned brother. It seems that TJ is not even emphasizing in order to really understand these words rather than preparing a jamat to implement those.
ALLAH has created man and send him to this earth for a test of his commitment and association towards ALLAH. In this the main litmus test are Hunger, SEX, Life Love and thinking /recognition of his creator.
The mankind also make its rule of living under the three broader terms mainly divided into two majors 1. Individual level, 2 Collective Level.
1. Aielli Laws (Personal Laws) Birth celebrations/Death Functions/Marriage etc.
2. Religious beliefs (Belife in one GOD, Several GODs, No GOD etc)
3. Marriages /Sex (One want to circle around fire, nikkah or zinna etc)
All above mentioned laws can be implemented at personal level without any confrontation on collective level. And all these are implemented in MADINA by RASSOLLAH SAW so why he challenge then the collective system after this and strives all his remaining life for the collective system change (Because thats what ALLAH is demanding from his MOMINS (if one reads QURAN Alone he can clearly understands it by himself)
Now at the collective level
1. Political System (This is what u have said "RESPONSIBLE" It includes Internal policies, foreign policies, defense policies all under shariah (Why QURAN is teaching again and again to us if we r not responsible???)
Currentally Dajali system i.e Secularism entirely captures it in the whole world, ALLAH is locked in Mosque, Mandar, Church and we r satisfying ourselves by just calling people to good deeds, I mean no vision about organizing, preparing, planning and educating them from QURAN???
2. Economic system (Riba free implementation) Currentally its under the capitalism and we are just saying that its personal matter tell me how a muslim could tackle his or her daily transactions under the rule of ALLAH when the system in which he or she is shopping have capitalistic base??? He or she can not purely isolated so that can transact only in home!!
3. Social System ( This is the most important and serve as a base being the 1,2 as its floors) This determines the man woman relations, limitations, haqooq and fraiz. And the mankind could never solve out this problem without ALLAHs System or guidance. Dajali System have completely destroyed the above two collective systems in our so called ISLAMIC STATE and now its also attacking extensively to wipe out the remaining 3 Collective system / Social System. Do u think that we are not responsible for that. Its the leaders who r responsible which themselves are fully drowned in the western imperialism and colonialism influences. Who r the leaders, people around us becomes leaders. But from the intelligentsia group and they also reconcile with the Current Dajali system. All they know is just like TJ ISLAM is a name of just some practices someone is more religious and someone is less!!!!!!!!!!!!! But where is the "DEEN" and if we are not responsible than who will be????
I will talk later about how this actually works in changing our perspective (TJ, Deoband etc) of "DEEN". Which is very opposite to the Way of life of our beloved Prophet MUHAMMAD SAW. It starts from the english imperialism in Baray sageer Pak o Hind that lead us into two schools of thought 1. Sir syed school of thought and 2. Deoband School of thought. But alas i m afriad that nobody really interests in QURANIC Thought and guidance at that time.
"Do u Think that We made this world and heavens and all lies in b/w them in play". Dust will turn into the dust ALLAH AKBAR.
Try Bayan ul Quran:
Allow me to be brief since much of your cocerns have been dealt already in previous threads.
Rasponsible are the leaders, then the ulamas, then the individuals based on the level of responsibility each shares. No responsibilty is being thrown to anyone brother, it is being directed to the rightful people. If your leaders are corrupt.. it is not Islams fault ! It is the fault of those citizens who have degraded their islamic values so much that ALL they can produce to lead them is more corrupt people. Deoband or TJ's dont say that.. Rasulullahsaid that!
Stating that everyone is simply satisfied with "he is doing fine calm and quite no threat to his life and what so ever concerns." would be an accusation. Perhaps you have not done your prior search. The mujahada that TJ takes in bringing people back to islam and into masajid is something a civilian has hardly faced in his life of state building. Any how this statement would only hold true if you give some concrete examples.
Your question of amr bil ma'ruf was answered here before .. Even at that time the question was posed by you.. http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...&postcount=978
For some reason I sensed from your WHOLE post that you think TJ inculcates that only the work of TJ should be done.. If you have thought that or learnt that.. then you are seriously mistaken.And what about Rasulullah SAW u said he deliver HAQ and leave the rest to ALLAH!!. I m afraid that its not true, He scarifies his entire life to implement this ALLAH's System (This is absolute logical how can ALLAH's system bare that it should be suppressed by any man made system like Secular Approach i.e Lock ALLAH into Mosque / Mandar / Church we will pray him there but Out of these premises we r our self sovereignand the followers just keep on conveying good talks to the masses and think that what have done our duty to ALLAH.
Have you actually heard any bayans of Tablighi Ulama? or have simply thought that they "just call to good" and dont worry about socio welfare of Ummah! Please read through the earlier thread to learn the level of integration between TJ, its work and the social life structure. It would surprize you that TJ even rectifies the working life style. No one is asked to give time to the work except on a specific pattern.. JUST so that they can carry their lively duties alongside as well.
Again brother, your post not only shows unawareness of TJ and its workings, rather also ignorance of Islamic History. History is not what you would find in Raheeq al Makhtum, Khalid bin Walid, Muhammad (of Matin Lings), and others Seerah books like that.. Many of them although master pieces in their own categories fail miserably to display the historical perspective of daily living. Read Hayatus Sahaba and see what delegation were were sent to different places to teach them Islam.. I have enumerated some of these in previous threads as well and will not waste time posting again. Please do your research before laying such claims.OUR BELOVED RASOOLLAH SAW never preaches like that after Hijira (Yes this type of tabligh was carried out in Makkah where the QURAN didnt give permission to actively resist), But after that He always strive to encounter the actual dominant forces at that time to implement the real DEEN (Soco economic political) System. U can read the history He himself engages and forced to drive the Mushrikeen e MAKKAH into the armed confliction as no advancement of any sort has been attempted by the Mushrikeen themselves firstly on to MADINA, so why RASOOULLAH SAW had not just sit back and do this sort of preaching in MADINA??QURAN also mentions it hundred times that whatever rule or environment who make it difficult for a muslim to follow the commandment will be the FITNA. And fight against it until u restore the ALLAH's commandment over it!!.
What about the JIHAD / QITAAL which is present in half of the QURAN teachings, Against what??? We are not beaten or even threatened by anyone in doing this sort of preaching of good deeds (Just go to Mosque pray and dont look at the bilboards and listen to the up beating songs in the neighborhood). So are we conforming what QURAN teaches (Life Sacrifices)?? We are looking the LAWS OF ALLAH at the peoples feet in this system, but do nothing actively against them by trowing out the responsibility upon some one "RESPONSIBLE". Of course i m not saying for standing up actively against such an organized system of KUFR, but somehow this should clarify at least in the menifesto i.e if we are strengthen up to so and so number level then we will actively engaged in the field against these munkiraats. But nothing is like that in TJ's draft? Our Beloved RASOOULLAH has never send any kind of preacher to any of the surroundings even after the fatah Makkah. He rather sends his forces/Mujahideens to implement the ALLAH's SYSTEM and yes after that implementation the non muslim people themselves attracted towards the ISLAMIC teachings. Munafqeen at that time also sincerely advices the muslims against JIHAD/QITAAL by saying that why r u confronting with those Musriks we should deal them with humbly senseably and should not fight etc. (Extreme Life love)
From Madinah in the inception of Jihad.. the order was that each and every able body must go out at war. Why was Sayiduna Usman r.a asked to stay home in Uhud? Would not be liable to follow that law?As for as ur scho economic political system explanation is concerned brother. It seems that TJ is not even emphasizing in order to really understand these words rather than preparing a jamat to implement those.
ALLAH has created man and send him to this earth for a test of his commitment and association towards ALLAH. In this the main litmus test are Hunger, SEX, Life Love and thinking /recognition of his creator.
The mankind also make its rule of living under the three broader terms mainly divided into two majors 1. Individual level, 2 Collective Level.
1. Aielli Laws (Personal Laws) Birth celebrations/Death Functions/Marriage etc.
2. Religious beliefs (Belife in one GOD, Several GODs, No GOD etc)
3. Marriages /Sex (One want to circle around fire, nikkah or zinna etc)
All above mentioned laws can be implemented at personal level without any confrontation on collective level. And all these are implemented in MADINA by RASSOLLAH SAW so why he challenge then the collective system after this and strives all his remaining life for the collective system change (Because thats what ALLAH is demanding from his MOMINS (if one reads QURAN Alone he can clearly understands it by himself)
I had a complete article on Tablighi Jamaat and Jihad.. it should be somewhere online.. please search for it. it will help.
Br, every issue of Shariah has its laws .. you cannot simply take something to be and implement without it being handled by its rightful authority. Tablighi Jamat has set a goal toward bring the Ummah to Salaah and they are doing so. This does not mean that a person who is a Tableeghi cannot be a Mujahid or cannot be a Politician. TJ is a specialized field and they are carrying out their work much better than any other organization at current.
Is this foreign policy equally a responsibility of The streethawker, and the Chamar who comes by your place to clean your toiletry?? All these are valid fields but to be handled by their rightful people. I think what you are hinting is Issues pertainingto Khilafa. Then please know TJ doesnt have goals of khilafa.Now at the collective level
1. Political System (This is what u have said "RESPONSIBLE" It includes Internal policies, foreign policies, defense policies all under shariah (Why QURAN is teaching again and again to us if we r not responsible???)
Currentally Dajali system i.e Secularism entirely captures it in the whole world, ALLAH is locked in Mosque, Mandar, Church and we r satisfying ourselves by just calling people to good deeds, I mean no vision about organizing, preparing, planning and educating them from QURAN???
You Allah might be locked in mandar masjid or church.. We have Allah in our hearts at all time.. Allah's nusrah and help is there in the severe travels of TJ as well as sweet shade of mosques. Please do not trivialize the work of Da'wah. Da'wa Ila Allah is a huge field of Deen. much more important than some political game which has achieved nothing for Ummah but more disgrace. If you wish to enter politics you have to have the basic deen imaan and same Masjid mentality to keep a straight aim of pleasing Allah..
Is Iman and Tauheed not from Quran?
Is Salah and its importance not from Quran?
Is Ikram al Muslimeen not from Quran?
Is Muamalat not from Quran..
...all the aspects which Tablighi Jamaat teaches are from Quran. Why are only your eye running on filters of politics?
TJ has been and still instilling Allah conciousness in innumerable Ulama, Doctors, engineers, accountants, sportsment, entertainers... Please show me such a level of change from any other organization geared at claiming the work towards politics in the name of Islam.. please name a few?
Who said it is a personal matter? Are you not reading the posts. The Mufti that sits in front of me and gives thousands of fatwas in islamic Finance and Law claims to be a product of TJ!?!2. Economic system (Riba free implementation) Currentally its under the capitalism and we are just saying that its personal matter tell me how a muslim could tackle his or her daily transactions under the rule of ALLAH when the system in which he or she is shopping have capitalistic base??? He or she can not purely isolated so that can transact only in home!!
Is its a da'ii duty to teach the awam how to engage in economics? You are physicist.. please tell me when was the last time you taught anyone how to give Ghusal to a deadbody? Isnt that one of the ahkam of Deen? Please do answer this one.
Now tell me when was the last time you made a session to teach people how to write their legal will. Sayyidina Umar r.a said that a muslim does not go THREE days except that he revises his will. Tell me br. how many have you told how to "tackle" his or hers will? Or for that tell me.. have you yourself learnt it?!?
Br. perhaps you are sitting too much in secularism that all you see around you is secularism imperialism. I see hope and more and more good fortune for the Ummah from the effots of TJ. Perhaps your understanding of Deen is wrong.. Please tell me what is your understanding of deen?3. Social System ( This is the most important and serve as a base being the 1,2 as its floors) This determines the man woman relations, limitations, haqooq and fraiz. And the mankind could never solve out this problem without ALLAHs System or guidance. Dajali System have completely destroyed the above two collective systems in our so called ISLAMIC STATE and now its also attacking extensively to wipe out the remaining 3 Collective system / Social System. Do u think that we are not responsible for that. Its the leaders who r responsible which themselves are fully drowned in the western imperialism and colonialism influences. Who r the leaders, people around us becomes leaders. But from the intelligentsia group and they also reconcile with the Current Dajali system. All they know is just like TJ ISLAM is a name of just some practices someone is more religious and someone is less!!!!!!!!!!!!! But where is the "DEEN" and if we are not responsible than who will be????
BTW.. what books from scholars have to studied in the Socio Economic Political DEEN. please highligh a couple of main core books you have studied. Jazak Allah.I will talk later about how this actually works in changing our perspective (TJ, Deoband etc) of "DEEN". Which is very opposite to the Way of life of our beloved Prophet MUHAMMAD SAW. It starts from the english imperialism in Baray sageer Pak o Hind that lead us into two schools of thought 1. Sir syed school of thought and 2. Deoband School of thought. But alas i m afriad that nobody really interests in QURANIC Thought and guidance at that time.
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Brother yes i have quoted from the scholar who was engaged in Dars e Quran since 50 years!!. Its the history bro our own Hanafi Scholars quoted these things in their Tafseers and Books, starting from Shiekh ul Hind (Ahmed Sarhandi), Mulana dehlvi, syed ahmed bralvi etc. I will provide ur the entire list of scholars. Anyways ISLAM is mostly spread by force its a fact u cant deny. Thats an other Aspect that ISLAM never forces any kafir to become a muslim but Rasoollah SAW always made lashkars of mujahideens to attack surroundings no matter how strong the kufars at that time ( There are two super powers present at that time after fatah makka i.e Qisra Empire and Qiaser Empire (Roman and Iranian) Rasooullah SAW arranged two lashkars for them even at the time of his Wasal Shrief!!. And after his Wasal some Fake Prophets stand up Musalima Kazab and many people advised Abu Bakar RA to stop one of the above mentioned Laskar as it would be beneficiary for madina defense but Abu Bakar RA rejects that advice by saying that how can i stop that task of spreading ISLAM who was commanded by Rasooullah SAW himself.!!
(Thats a long story brothers u should study starting from the Bani Israiel history, then Christians (catholic/protestants), then MUHAMMAD SAW revolution and counter revolutionary forces (Abdullah Abn e Saba Jew, Shia Sunni conflict / Jang e jabal / Karbala Incident etc)
Anyways i m not criticizing the work of TJ here u dont fully understand my stance.
TJ should get reward for its individual efforts, what i m saying is that they should also stand up against the Kufr System at least verbally, as they are in great numbers and themselves are making a HUJAAT upon their Organization. ALLAH can ask them why they didnt raise a voice when my commandments are were trated disrespectfully despite of the fact that they were in numbers at that time.
My friend abuhajira said harshly to me that My ALLAH is locked in Mosque / Mandir or Church and his ALLAH is in his heart!!. No offense brother u cant betray ALLAH by just claiming his love from ur tongue only. if ur blood doesn't boil while the people around u trample the ALLAH's law/Commandment and shriah so openly at their feet and u think that u love ALLAH then i must say that u r in the fools paradise.
ALLAH doesn't needs some rasoomat / practices from us without any kind of Commitment and Association. Thats why QUARN always says NAMAZ QAIEM KARO its not like ur thinking of NAMAZ Parhoo. At last but not the least let me quote the direct verses of QURAN so that i can make myself more clear to u. May ALLAH give me courage and knowledge in order to do that.
Moreover From ur reply i came to know clearly that TJ give no importance to
1. Khilafat (No Islam other than Khilafat, QURAN tells us so)
2. Islamic State (With out it u can never implement ALLAH's Shriah even at individual level on which TJ is working, it can be done momentarily only)
3. TJ just emphasize the tazkia at individual level without bothering about the Environment and surrounding system of that Individual.
4. And if TJ thinks that when they change all the people then SYSTEM will be automatically be corrected, then i must say that they are very innocent cum foolish as if it is so then the SARWAR E QAIYNAT MUHAMMAD SAW could bring all the people to the true path and he never ever take sword into his hand. And i think TJ is not qualified more than the messenger SAW of ALLAH.
Before my next reply i will recommend to read Surah BAQRA, INFAAL, KAHAF and MAIDA.
Dont get me wrong in any way, i just want to satisfy myself and if i will be satisfied at TJ workflow than its makes my life even easier a lot.
As for as ur questions of Gusal of deadbody and Will writing, yes i know that but its not that much important in ALLAHs sight brother try to understand me dont get ur self confused just in Fiqa matters, i remember a quote here from history that when english people invaded and capture hind, then the Fiqa Scholars were still busy in fighting at " can ALLAH say a lie? if no then how is he QADIR E MUTLAQ, and if yes then is it his SHAN to make a lie?? without even knowing the world around them as they will be going to enslaved in the next few seconds"
Now for ur reply of
Is Iman and Tauheed not from Quran?
Is Salah and its importance not from Quran?
Is Ikram al Muslimeen not from Quran?
Is Muamalat not from Quran..
...all the aspects which Tablighi Jamaat teaches are from Quran. Why are only your eye running on filters of politics
My filters are not on politics brothers, actually i have no filter at all like TJ who misses out the last in the above list JIHAAD/QITAAL. And belief me all u have mentioned are the steps towards reaching that level, QURAN guide us towards the same step by step but the last goal is somehow different than the TJ's Perspective as they install a filter on that!! just because to make life easy, safe and sound.
As for as ur DEEN question is concerned i can send u a listening DEEN AUR MAZHAB MAIN FARQ its in urdu. just send me ur email address.
ALLAH HAFIZ
"Do u Think that We made this world and heavens and all lies in b/w them in play". Dust will turn into the dust ALLAH AKBAR.
Try Bayan ul Quran:
what is the point in standing up for your rights verbally when firstly, its not going to make much difference (otherwise considering the way muslims of all kind are standing up2speak verbally for our rights we would be in want of no 'rights') and secondly, what difference will it make when our words have no weight, due to lack of a'amaal?
The Prophet converted people and changed their opinion of the faith and Muslims simply through his character. We have no hope of anyone giving over to us unless they see the beauty of the sunnah in our every way of life.
There is evidence of this: look at the situation in Palestine/Jerusalem. A while back my father told us about when he met the Palestinian ameer of Tableegh in London. The Ameer related how in those parts of Palestine where Tableegh is wide and practised, even the Jews are decent to them and give them jobs etc, because they see that these people have excellent character and are only interested in bettering themselves.
Also, if you will read accounts of gazwaat in the time of the Prophet, you will notice that Jihad (physical fighting) was only ever the Last resort. Before every battle, firstly dawah was givena nd they were invited to accept Islam. If they didn't agree to that, then they were given the option to live peacefully under Muslim rule. Only if all effort failed, did they engage in physical battle.
~ Certainly There is For You In The Messenger Of Allah, An Excellent Example. (33:21) ~
brother i can add 101 things more in ur list. but what u wanna proof through this? are they only responcible for stablishing islam? what sheikh saad said was: tabligh is not whole islam, its dawah for whole islam. so what they are doing is only a part of islam and not whole islam. so why critisizing them for only one aspect with which they are doing whatever they can. Or should they leave it also?
TJ should give dawah
TJ should stablish khalifah
TJ should do Jihad
TJ should opüen madrassah
TJ should work for khatmeh nabuwwah
TJ should give dawah to non muslim.
how many things should they do more? whatever they are doing just to get an inspiration for practising something.
I know a lot of people , who were jahil and busy with dunya. after getting involve in jamah, they become salafi, got addmission in a madrasah, sit in the khanqah, started politic with JI, attend lecture of sh.azhar for jihad.
In my little life alhamdulillah i have seen a lot of kind of people who get involved in all this things though TJ.
People accused TJ that they dont talk about tawheed,politic,this and that. how it sounds when a jamah is facing enemy and let start a talk about tawheed in battlefield? how does it sound? it depends on the situation.
at the battlefield people dont give bayan about tawheed for 2 hours, but does it mean they dont give importance to tawheed or do they neglect it?
ask yourself brother and tell us what do u think.
Then brother it will be sufficient to point you to check our the incident of Bir Maoona.
For your claim of no jamat or delegation being sent to muslims to teach.. please refer to this small article from Hazrat Sheikh Zakariya..
I hope that will irradicate any misunderstandings.Can Tableegh be done to the Muslims? If this is not the way of Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم and Sahaba then it is a Bida’.
It is strange the the Ahlul Ilm may pose such a question. We know that Amr bil Ma’roof Wa Niahiya Anil Munkar is a Ma’moor Behi and we had also understood from the answer to the “Jihad issue” that anything that inculcates propagating of truth is within the meanings of Jihad. With that there should be no difficulty in justifying such work. If the Maqsood is the “propagation” then any means which is mubah in Sharia will also be included within that ma’moor behi.
Are we to say that the system of Madaris for learning Deen; The semester system; examination system etc are not a necessity of the day and age? Indeed they are, yet they were not present at the time of Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم. They fought with arrows and swords. Fighting was the ma’moor behi and using any means to achieve that mean as long as it is mubah shar’ann will be included in ma’moor behi. This is why cannons and guns are also in the same place as sword and arrows, otherwise they will be bida’ as well.
More so, how many Shuruhaat and Hawashis were present in time of Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم. Even Bukhari compilation was not there. These means are only Mubah methods of achieving the Ilm ud Deen. If anyone is to say that these only refer to Amaliyaat and not Ibaadiyat then where does this Jamaat of Salâah comes from wherein the congregations starts at the strike of a clock. When the clock strikes 1:30 PM (eg for Dhuhur), no matter if the Imam is present or not, no matter the regular mussallees are present or not.. the Salâah is started on the dot. Then this indeed should have been bida’. Having understood the stand regarding Ma’moor Behi, let us look at the scenario whether Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم sent any delegation (Jamaat) to other muslims.
It should be understood well that teaching someone Ilm of Deen is Tableegh. For a logical mind, he should know that Tableegh to a non-Muslim is nothing but a teaching of Ilm of Allah and His Quraan, which starts with tauheed. It is this knowledge of tauheed and Risaalah that you are delivering to the non-Muslim, whereby he makes the decision of becoming a Muslim. The name of this process of teaching is thus termed “Tableegh (deliverance)”. If this is known, then is it so hard to perceive that the deliverance is not complete until the whole knowledge is delivered. Thus delivering of knowledge of deen is in fact within the process of tableegh.
Again, those who are of knowledge should not be asking this, lest they have not done their homework. For this I refer to you a book of great reverence which everyone should read. “Hayaatus Sahaba” by Maulânâ Yusuf Kandhelvi r.a. Maulânâ Saheb r.a has specifically made a chapter titled “Baab Irsaal As-Sahaba Ila Al-Baldaan Li-ta’leem” (i.e Chapter regarding dispatching of Sahaba to the cities for education). In this Maulânâ Yusuf r.a has recorded numerous Ahadith. ( Hayaatus Sahaba Vol.3 Pg. 280 , Arabic version, Al-Batba’a Al Milliya) For those who cannot read Arabic, it is suggested that they should aquire a copy of English Hayaatus Sahaba (Lives of the Companions; Vol.3 Pg. 236).
Hadhrat Asim bin Umar bin Qataadah narrates that, delegates from the Udhal and Qaara tribes, both from the branches of Jadeelah, came to Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم after Uhud requesting a Jamaat (delegation) to be sent so that they can learn deen. Thereafter Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم made tashkeel of a Jamaat comprising of 6 Sahaaba. He صلى الله عليه وسلم made Marthad bin Abu Marthad (R.A) as the Ameer. (Haakim Vol. 3 Pg. 222)
The hadeeth shows that a Jamaat was organized to be sent to a Muslim land to teach Muslims about the basics of Islam.
Thereafter we also have the incident of Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم sending Hadhrat Ali (R.A) to Yamen to teach the Muslims about the basics of deen. (Ibn Jareer as quoted in Muntakhab Kunzul Ummal Vol. 5 Pg. 37).
Muaadh ibn Jabal (R.A) is sent to Yamen as mentioned in a long narration to teach the people and to be a Mufti for them. Here again a Muslim goes to another land of Muslims to teach them about deen. (Haakim Vol 3. Pg 267)
Hadhrat Amaar (R.A) is sent to the tribe of Qais to teach Sharia of Islam. Upon reaching there he finds them to be like wild animals. He returns to Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم and is sent back again. (Bazaar and Tabrani in his Kabeer; also in Targheeb Wa Tarheeb Vol 1. Pg. 91)
Similarly incidents of Hadhrat Ammaar (R.A) and Hadhrat Abdullah bin Mad’ood (R.A) to Kufa (Ibn Sa’d Vol. 6 Pg. 7); Hadhrat Imraan (R.A) to Basrah (Ibn Sa’d Vol. 7 Pg 10); Hadhrat Muadh bin Jabal and Hadhrat Abu Darda (R.A) to Shaam (Ibn Sa’d Vol. 4 Pg. 172) are also mentioned.
From these above ahadeeth, it is established without doubt that Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم did send Sahaba (at times one, and at other times two or more) to Muslims in order to inculcate the basics of Shariah.
Normally “Tableegh” is incorrectly ascribed to calling non-Muslims into the folds of Islam. We understand from the lives of Sahaba R.A that their Tableegh was much more then merely getting a person to say Shahada. Their Tableegh also included Nusrah (help) of these new Muslims as well as old Muslims. It also included taking out time to specifically visit an individual to ask him about his needs, remind him of Deen and Akhira. This and more, is the completion of the same process of Da’wa that he had started by inviting someone into the folds of islam.
The only difference we see is that Jamaat Tableegh has taken these aspects and made an organized system out of it, just like the Ulama took similar aspects regarding knowledge and made the system of schools and madrassahs out of it. The Tableegh is the Ma’moor Bihi (that which has been commanded) and Jamaat Tableegh and Madrassah (and others) are mere Asbaab (means) to attain that goal of Tableegh.
Finally, one could also argue that, then why does Jamaat Tableegh say that they are in the path to rectify them selves. This is also a positive aspect of Jamaat Tableegh, that it has inculcated a system to start the tableegh in an inward-out fashion. Just like when the ripples in water spread far and wide, the most effect is in the middle at the origin of the ripple; A person in Jamaat first focuses the Tableegh towards his Nafs. Thereafter he tries to spread it outward. The more times he calls out to others, that many more times he calls out to his nafs. This repetitive action helps him keep accountability of his own basics before they go outward towards other recipients.
You will keep repeating the same thing, so shall I keep repeating the same as well. Have you seen the paramedics of PAK militiary carrying out the missions of the commando core? Bhai, one organization is with one purpose the other is with another.Anyways i m not criticizing the work of TJ here u dont fully understand my stance.
TJ should get reward for its individual efforts, what i m saying is that they should also stand up against the Kufr System at least verbally, as they are in great numbers and themselves are making a HUJAAT upon their Organization. ALLAH can ask them why they didnt raise a voice when my commandments are were trated disrespectfully despite of the fact that they were in numbers at that time.
How do you know that those involved in TJ have not raised voices against the Zulm? A person who spends 3 days a month might be spending 2 months with mujahideen at another time, while another may be spending 6 months with the destitute muslim.. How can you say that they are are not doing anything for other matters. But when they are in TJ, they do what TJ does.. and they do it well.
I gave a similar example before.. A doctor who does surgery as well as Teaches in a Med University. Do you ever see him doing surgery while he is teaching in his university. Even though he is qualified in both field he does what is before him. A person in khurooj in TJ will do what is before him.
Dont get too upset brother. You used that statement two times to show that while Allah is locked up.. TJ and our Ulama alike are satisfied in their luxury ...My friend abuhajira said harshly to me that My ALLAH is locked in Mosque / Mandir or Church and his ALLAH is in his heart!!.
how can ALLAH's system bare that it should be suppressed by any man made system like Secular Approach i.e Lock ALLAH into Mosque / Mandar / Church we will pray him there but Out of these premises we r our self sovereignALLAH is locked in Mosque, Mandar, Church and we r satisfying ourselves by just calling people to good deeds, I mean no vision about organizing, preparing, planning and educating them from QURAN???So next time you see a murtad in pakistan.. will you go an kill him?? Thats the rule right.. We all understand the blood boils.. but that does not allow us to take the Shariah into our own judgement. The rightful will cary out the rights. If the imam of your masjid is late for salaah.. do you step up and take his place?? No, because that is his right..No offense brother u cant betray ALLAH by just claiming his love from ur tongue only. if ur blood doesn't boil while the people around u trample the ALLAH's law/Commandment and shriah so openly at their feet and u think that u love ALLAH then i must say that u r in the fools paradise.
If you are saying that Nahi anil munkar is giving you right to carry out ta'zeer and lashes and hudood without any Qadhi.. that I am sorry.. I am not sure whether I will be in fools paradise or not .. but you will be is an anarchists paradise..
Then why do you pray if you dont want to carry out the "rasoomat". Brother.. we are not rasmi Maulvies here.. We are follwing Shariah. Tell me what does it mean to "Qaym" Namaz and not Parhoo. Does it mean that now that you have establish salah.. you dont have to carry out the reading part? Namaz Parhna is within the core of Namaz Qayim Karna. And Alhamdulillah TJ has established more essence of Salah then Tanzeem Islami or any Maududi sruggle ( I understood your approach from the title of the book you have given me ) May Allah give Tanzeem and Jamat Islami its reward where its due but if only they had understood the status of learning Deen from Ulama.. they would have done much more.ALLAH doesn't needs some rasoomat / practices from us without any kind of Commitment and Association. Thats why QUARN always says NAMAZ QAIEM KARO its not like ur thinking of NAMAZ Parhoo. At last but not the least let me quote the direct verses of QURAN so that i can make myself more clear to u. May ALLAH give me courage and knowledge in order to do that.
Please read "Hakeemul Ummat ke siyaasi Afkaar" by Mufti Taqi Usmani Saheb to get a grip of what is the priority and understanding in the aspects of Khilafa. I do not need to go more into it.Moreover From ur reply i came to know clearly that TJ give no importance to
1. Khilafat (No Islam other than Khilafat, QURAN tells us so)
2. Islamic State (With out it u can never implement ALLAH's Shriah even at individual level on which TJ is working, it can be done momentarily only)
Incorrect... you understood wrong.. please read the previous thread completely to get the complete Idea..3. TJ just emphasize the tazkia at individual level without bothering about the Environment and surrounding system of that Individual.
"Could bring" is a weak argument.. If that were the case Allah could also give everyone Islam... then you argument falls away. TJ is fulfiling the priority need. Again refer to the reading mentioned above...4. And if TJ thinks that when they change all the people then SYSTEM will be automatically be corrected, then i must say that they are very innocent cum foolish as if it is so then the SARWAR E QAIYNAT MUHAMMAD SAW could bring all the people to the true path and he never ever take sword into his hand. And i think TJ is not qualified more than the messenger SAW of ALLAH.
Alhamdulillah I have gone through ALL of them with a teacher and its tafseer as well.Before my next reply i will recommend to read Surah BAQRA, INFAAL, KAHAF and MAIDA.
And dont get me wrong either. I have had enough JI and TI friends in my youth to understand completely where you are coming from.Dont get me wrong in any way, i just want to satisfy myself and if i will be satisfied at TJ workflow than its makes my life even easier a lot.
Shame.. this is the haal of our Ummahs understanding. RasulullahAs for as ur questions of Gusal of deadbody and Will writing, yes i know that but its not that much important in ALLAHs sightmentioned.. the first knowledge to be lifted from muslims will be that of inheritance... Rasulullah
called meeraath "Nisf ul Ilm"... do you realize that NISF UL ILM.. The amount of reward one gains from learning and teaching this Ilm is equal to that of learning and teaching Quran!!! This is the importance in ALLAH's sight.. i dont know which deen told you that amaarat is more important than what Rasulullah
himself mentions in his mubarak ahadith.
How would you like to know after death that there was none around you to give you proper ghusal and burrial? Just ponder and Importance will seep in, inshAllah
Those questions are not Fiqhi question brother.. that is Aqeeda.. And we are not wrapped in our Ilm that much.. Our Muftiyaan have a good grasp of current affairs.. I can assure you of that.. much more than those who are blinded by linear goals of either khilafa, dinaar system, or other such less important aspects..brother try to understand me dont get ur self confused just in Fiqa matters, i remember a quote here from history that when english people invaded and capture hind, then the Fiqa Scholars were still busy in fighting at " can ALLAH say a lie? if no then how is he QADIR E MUTLAQ, and if yes then is it his SHAN to make a lie?? without even knowing the world around them as they will be going to enslaved in the next few seconds"
Why are you on the internet.. why arent you in jihad at moment? What about your family and all your relatives.. why arent they in jihaad and qitaal.My filters are not on politics brothers, actually i have no filter at all like TJ who misses out the last in the above list JIHAAD/QITAAL.
Secondly, where did I said that TJ denounces jihad and Qitaal.. baseless claim brother.. please substanciate..
Subhanallah.. your last step is Qitaal?? Lahawlawala Quwa ta Illa Billa.. Br. please do some reading learning. Let me repost the Aspect of Tablighi Jamaat and Jihad .. That should also increase some knowledge..And belief me all u have mentioned are the steps towards reaching that level, QURAN guide us towards the same step by step but the last goal is somehow different than the TJ's Perspective as they install a filter on that!! just because to make life easy, safe and sound.
How can Jamaat Tableegh use the ahadeeth of Jihad as a parable to them "going out" in path of Allah?
This question has been replied in full from Hazrat Maulânâ Zakariyah (rahimuhullah alayh). I will try to present the same content with some additional information which I have understood from my teachers. Hazrat Maulana Zakariyah (rahimuhullah alayh) mentions that, “…had this question came from laymen, I would have had no surprise to it, but this question has actually been risen by people of knowledge (Ahl ul Ilm)”. Ulema know that even though the well known (Ma'rûf) understanding of Jihad by way of customary understanding is Qitaal (to engage in a battle field) but Juristic proofs (Nass) and Linguistics (Lugha) does not make Jihad specific to Qitaal alone. It is understood that its meaning is much broader then that. The fact is that the actual meaning of Jihad revolves around upholding the Word of Allah and Qitaal is only the last and final resort in a situation where no other way of reconciliation is found. Thus Qitaal is not the actual object (Maqsoodul Asl) of Jihad.
Tafsir Mazhari explains in the explaination of "كُتِبَ عَلَيْكُمُ الْقِتَالُ وَهُوَ كُرْهٌ لَكُمْ” (2:216), that the virtue of Jihad is above all other rewards because it is a means of spreading Islam and a means of guidance for the mankind. Thus anyone who gets guided from this effort, his reward will be added to the rewards of those strugglers (mujahidîn) who became the means of his guidance. Furthermore, what would be even more virtuous, are the Uloom of apparent (Zahir) and unseen (Baatin) since they propagate the reality of Islam even more.
Now with that understanding if we see the sheer amount of guidance this work of Tableegh has brought, no sane person can deny it. Thousands of Muslims have reformed themselves towards praying punctually, even many non-Muslims have come into folds of Islam.
The complete discussion on the meaning of Jihad is available in the books of Hazrat Sheikh Maulânâ Zakariya Kandhalvi (“Awjaz ul Masalik Saharh Muwatta Malik” and “Hashia of Laami’ad daraari ‘alaaJami’ al bukhari”). According to Shariah, the definition of Jihad is “to struggle”, and that it refers to the “Qitaal of Kufr” and its generalized understanding (Itlaaq) is even in the meaning of Mujahada of Nafs. This would thus even include struggle against Shaitaan, as well as transgressors (Fussaaq).
The Jihad with Kuffar is by way of hand as well as by way of tongue. The hadeeth of Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم is famous wherein the definition of Mujahid is given.
المجاهد من جاهد نفسه فى طاعة الله (مشكوة صـ15 سـ4)
Actual Mujahid is the one who struggles against ones own Nafs in obedience to Allah
The hadeeth of Sayyiduna Jaber (radïAllahû Anhûis famous wherein Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم mentions about returning from smaller struggle (Jihad Asghar) to major struggle (Jihad Akbar). Hazrat Maulânâ Zakariya (rahimuhullah alayh) knew that people would argue about the authenticity of this hadeeth. Thus he mentions that any argument on the weakness of such ahadeeth is waived when the ahadeeth is used in Fadha’il and secondly the numbers of these ahâdîth also diminish that confusion.
Ulema have clarified that Prayer, Fast etc are more virtuous than Jihad since they are the actual objectives themselves (Maqasid Li’einehi) and that is above Jihad. This is because the objective of Jihad is to bring more and more people to practice according to Imaan and good morals. This is even strengthened by the saying of Ibn Abideen who said that, there is no doubt that Faraidh of Salaah and Zakaah etc. are more virtuous than Jihad since one is actual obligation (Fardh ul Ain) and the later is sufficient obligation (Fardh ul Kifaaya) and that the Jihad is ordained only to establish Salâah and Imaan. This is why its goodness is not within itself rather because of the goodness of another action that comes because of it (Hasan lighayrihi). And goodness of Salâah is within itself. Thus any effort made for establishing the Hasan Li’einihi becomes Hasan Lighairihi.
Imaam Bukhari (rahimuhullah alayh) in his Saheeh has presented the following hadeeth in Book of Jihad (Kitaab ul Jihad):
مَا اغْبَرَّتْ قَدَمَا عَبْدٍ فِي سَبِيلِ اللَّهِ فَتَمَسَّهُ النَّارُ
No dust afflicts a slave in path of Allah, lest that the fire touches it
Then Imam Bukhari (rahimuhullah alayh) establishes a whole chapter regarding walking for the Salaatul Jumma, and presents a similar hadeeth as follows:
مَنْ اغْبَرَّتْ قَدَمَاهُ فِي سَبِيلِ اللَّهِ حَرَّمَهُ اللَّهُ عَلَى النَّارِ
Those feet which get soiled in path of Allah, Allah will make fire Haraam on them.
Please note that the second hadeeth is regarding going in path of Allah and Imam Bukhari (rahimuhullah alayh) has made it precedence (Istadlaal) for going to Jummah Salâah. Thus we may conclude that “fi sabil illah” has more than one connotation. Also, if Imam Sahib (rahimuhullah alayh) can do this much, then why is it so hard to understand that the scholars of Tableegh (Ulema e Muballigheen) have used them as precedence for going out in path of Allah for uplifting the word of Allah. Why can we blame the muballigheen and not Imam Sahib (rahimuhullah alayh)?
Hadhrat Dehelvi (rahimuhullah alayh) in his Malfûz has stated that, “this travel (the travel for Tableegh), hold the same qualities as that of battles of Rasulullah صلى الله عليه وسلم (Ghazwaat), and thus the hope is of such a reward as well. This though, is not Qitaal but is similar to it, which even though in some aspect be of a lesser rank, but in other aspects is greater then that.
Hazrat Maulânâ Zakariya Sahib (rahimuhullah alayh) mentions a narration of Hazrat Abu Musa Al Ashari (rahimuhullah alayh) that a person asked Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم regarding two people who go in jihad, one for the booty and the other to show off his bravery. Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم replied that the Jihad in path of Allah is only that which is done for the upholding of the word of Allah. (Bukhari) Hafiz Ibn Hajr (rahimuhullah alayh) says regarding this hadeeth that “Kalimat Allah” (Word of Allah) means “Call towards Allah i.e. his religion” (Da’waah Ila Allah).
From the life of Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم we understand that the meaning of Jihad is not linear as commonly understood rather it is dynamic and its generality encompasses aiding of that which is intended from jihad as well. People of knowledge know this very well. Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم has said that waking (guarding) for one night at the borders is better than the world and whatever is in it. And of course the guarding at the borders is not for Qitaal rather to make safety of the Imaan and Salâah of Muslims.
So much so, that even in battle where Qitaal is made, if the opponent says Shahada and accepts Islam, it becomes necessary to spare his life. The Qitaal was only there so that the other could accept the truth of Tauheed. If that is so, then indeed if he had accepted the truth even before Qitaal could start, his safety would have been necessitated and Qitaal would be avoided. Would any one then argue that that Muslim did not go for jihad because he did not end up fighting the opponent? From this we see that any struggle that brings one closer to the truth, may it be in accepting tauheed for the first time or may it be in starting to practice upon the tenets of that tauheed, all will be Jihad. Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم has said that aiding a person coming from jihad with wealth is also jihad and looking after their family in their absence is also jihad.
Hafiz Ibn Hajr (rahimuhullah alayh) says in Fathul Bâree that attaining the knowledge of the basic principles of deen (religion), studying islamic theology, propagation of good and forbidding of evil are all Jihad. Similarly authoring religious book, teaching different problem of deen (masa’il), refuting the claims of unbelievers, debating them are also Jihad. So much so that Imam Nawawi (rahimuhullah alayh) has presented thirteen different types of Jihad.
It comes in the Quran,
يَا أَيُّهَا النَّبِيُّ جَاهِدِ الْكُفَّارَ وَالْمُنَافِقِينَ
O Prophet! Make Jihad with the unbelievers and hypocrites. (9:73)
In this Ayah the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم has been commanded to do Jihad with the unbelievers and hypocrites. We know numerous incidents of Rasulullah صلى الله عليه وسلم doing Jihad bis Sayf (Qital or fighting with sword) with the unbelievers but this has not been the case with the hypocrites. Perhaps, rather certainly, the meaning of Jihad encompasses other forms besides Qital .
The same is the case in this other Ayah,
وَالَّذِينَ جَاهَدُوا فِينَا لَنَهْدِيَنَّهُمْ سُبُلَنَا
And those who do Jihad in our path we certainly guide them towards our way (29:69)
Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم sent out a Group of soldiers and said that, one from every two should go, then the reward for both will be same (meaning that the one left behind will look after the others family).
Do we not remember the incident of Khaybar. Sayyiduna Ali (radïAllahû Anhûwas given the flag. Thereafter he asked Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم, “Ya Rasul Allah, should I go and do Qitaal with them until they come into folds of Islam?” Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم replied, “Absolutely not, you go there and give them an invitation to come into folds of Islam first. If even one person accepts Islam then that will be better than red camels (booty), and if they deny then convince them to pay Jizya and if they even deny that then do Qitaal with them”. It is deduced from numerous ahadith that general conception of Jihad is not Qitaal rather the actual intention in it is Imaan and upholding Allah’s word.
Hazrat Maulânâ Zakariyya Shaheb (rahimuhullah alayh) continues after this as well, however I believe the understanding is now made that going out in Tableegh and establishing anything that makes the establishment of Imaan and Salâah etc can be attributed to Jihad and fi sabeelillah.
Finally, one more aspect that needs to be addressed here is that by proving the meaning of Jihad for Da’wah Ila Allah and fortifying the security and safety of Islam, does not mean that Qitaal is completely waived off. Remember that the Military Jihad is a branch within the branches of Jihad, and when one is carrying out one branch, he is not liable to carry out the other at the same time. Just as one would not hold a surgeon doctor, who is teaching in a Medical University to be liable for not carrying out surgery while he teaches. He can only fulfill one of his obligations at a time.
Thus, we have sufficiently addressed the role of Jihad in Tableegh and in Islam as a whole.
Abuhajira
you can send me the book at abuhajira@gmail.com .. if it is by some Alim..inshAllh I will read it.. otherwise I have a lot more books in queue to read at moment..As for as ur DEEN question is concerned i can send u a listening DEEN AUR MAZHAB MAIN FARQ its in urdu. just send me ur email address.
ALLAH HAFIZ
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jazakallahu khairan for the last article. i have it in bangla language, and was eagerly searching for the article in english langauge, and alhamdulilllah i got it today.
Hope people will read it with open eyes.
I will not wonder if any brother claims that : Imam bukhari did tehrif of hadiths or missused the hadiths. la hawla wala quwwata illa billah.
Last edited by abulayl; 13-09-2008 at 10:17 PM.
For those who know Bangla, here it is:
Tableegher Proshno Utthor
http://www.banglakitab.com/BanglaBoo...haukatAli).pdf
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It is reported from Abu Umamah from the Prophet (Sallallahu 'Alayhi WaSallam) that he said:
اتَّقُوا فِرَاسَةَ الْمُؤْمِنِ ، فَإِنَّهُ يَنْظُرُ بِنُورِ اللَّهِ
" Fear the Insight of the Believer, for verily he sees with the Light of God"
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