Muhadith Imam Al-Haramayn Ibn Al-Juwayni - Claims by the Shiite.

[Al-Kurdi]

Please, honoured brothers and sisters, take your time and read this Shiite leaflet:

The famous scholar al-Dhahabi says in Tadhkirat al-Huffaz, vol. 4, p. 298, and Ibn
Hajar al-'Asqalani says in al-Durar al-Kaminah, vol. 1, p. 67 that Sadruddin
Ibrahim bin Muhammad bin al-Hamawayh al-Juwayni al-Shafi'i was a great
scholar of Hadith. The same Al-Juwayni reports from Abdullah ibn Abbas (r)
from the Prophet (s) who said, "I am the chief of the Prophets and Ali ibn Abi
Talib is the chief of successors, and after me my successors shall be twelve,
the first of them being Ali ibn Abi Talib and the last of them being Al
Mahdi."
Al-Juwayni also narrates from Ibn 'Abbas (r) from the Prophet (s): "Certainly
my Caliphs and my legatees and the Proofs of Allah upon his creatures
after me are twelve. The first of them is my brother and the last of them is
my (grand) son." He was asked: "O Messenger of Allah, who is your brother?"
He said, "Ali ibn Abi Talib" Then they asked, "And who is your son?" The
Holy Prophet (s) replied, "Al Mahdi, the one who will fill the earth with justice
and equity like it would be brimming with injustice and tyranny. And by the
One Who has raised me as a warner and a give of good tidings, even if a day
remains for the life of this world, the Almighty Allah will prolong this day to an
extent till he sends my son Mahdi, then he will make Ruhullah 'Isa ibn Maryam
(a) to descend and pray behind him (Mahdi). And the earth will be illuminated
by his radiance. And his power will reach to the east and the west."
Al-Juwayni also narrates that the Messenger of Allah (s) informed: "I and Ali
and Hasan and Husayn and nine of the descendants of Husayn are the
purified ones and the inerrant."
[Al-Juwayni, Fara'id al-Simtayn, Mu'assassat al-Mahmudi li-Taba'ah, Beirut 1978, p. 160.]

Questions that arise after reading this:

a) As I am not fond of the "Copy-Paste"-Culture, I´d be glad if any brother or sister could confirm these quoted Ahadith in the originial books and if there has ocurred any changings in wording or terminology.

b) If these Ahadith are in these books, are they deemed as Sahih by the majority of scholars?

c) If yes, then on what basis. If no, then what is the Daleel?

d) What is the interpretation of these Ahadith and what conclusions could be made by reading these Ahadith?

for eventual answers, honoured brothers and sisters.

Note: I want answers, not people expressing how much they hate the irrelevance of the Shiites, since I have had enough of that. Try to be as objective as possible in your reasoning.

Please, bestow me your ideas so that I could be better prepared when discussing with Shiites, since all my relatives are Shiites.

[TripolySunni]

Please, honoured brothers and sisters, take your time and read this Shiite leaflet:

The famous scholar al-Dhahabi says in Tadhkirat al-Huffaz, vol. 4, p. 298, and Ibn
Hajar al-'Asqalani says in al-Durar al-Kaminah, vol. 1, p. 67 that Sadruddin
Ibrahim bin Muhammad bin al-Hamawayh al-Juwayni al-Shafi'i was a great
scholar of Hadith. The same Al-Juwayni reports from Abdullah ibn Abbas (r)
from the Prophet (s) who said, "I am the chief of the Prophets and Ali ibn Abi
Talib is the chief of successors, and after me my successors shall be twelve,
the first of them being Ali ibn Abi Talib and the last of them being Al
Mahdi."
Al-Juwayni also narrates from Ibn 'Abbas (r) from the Prophet (s): "Certainly
my Caliphs and my legatees and the Proofs of Allah upon his creatures
after me are twelve. The first of them is my brother and the last of them is
my (grand) son." He was asked: "O Messenger of Allah, who is your brother?"
He said, "Ali ibn Abi Talib" Then they asked, "And who is your son?" The
Holy Prophet (s) replied, "Al Mahdi, the one who will fill the earth with justice
and equity like it would be brimming with injustice and tyranny. And by the
One Who has raised me as a warner and a give of good tidings, even if a day
remains for the life of this world, the Almighty Allah will prolong this day to an
extent till he sends my son Mahdi, then he will make Ruhullah 'Isa ibn Maryam
(a) to descend and pray behind him (Mahdi). And the earth will be illuminated
by his radiance. And his power will reach to the east and the west."
Al-Juwayni also narrates that the Messenger of Allah (s) informed: "I and Ali
and Hasan and Husayn and nine of the descendants of Husayn are the
purified ones and the inerrant."
[Al-Juwayni, Fara'id al-Simtayn, Mu'assassat al-Mahmudi li-Taba'ah, Beirut 1978, p. 160.]

Questions that arise after reading this:

a) As I am not fond of the "Copy-Paste"-Culture, I´d be glad if any brother or sister could confirm these quoted Ahadith in the originial books and if there has ocurred any changings in wording or terminology.

b) If these Ahadith are in these books, are they deemed as Sahih by the majority of scholars?

c) If yes, then on what basis. If no, then what is the Daleel?

d) What is the interpretation of these Ahadith and what conclusions could be made by reading these Ahadith?

for eventual answers, honoured brothers and sisters.

Note: I want answers, not people expressing how much they hate the irrelevance of the Shiites, since I have had enough of that. Try to be as objective as possible in your reasoning.

Please, bestow me your ideas so that I could be better prepared when discussing with Shiites, since all my relatives are Shiites.

I think he is al Dahabi's Shiekh (one of his Teachers) and He wrote the book called Fara'ed el Samatayn, believe it or not He is a Shiite.

Cover of his Book here:

http://www.hajr-network.net/hajrvb/s...hp?p=406874137

He is not the Shafi'i that you know but the Shiites like to trick the sunni Laymen and tell them Imam el Shafi'i said this. His name is "Ibrahim bin mohammad bin Mo'ayyid Bin Abdullah bin Ali bin Mohammad el juwayni el Kharasani.

إبراهيم بن محمد بن المؤيد بن عبد الله بن علي بن محمد بن حمويه . الإمام الكبير المحدث ، شيخ المشايخ صدر الدين أبو المجامع الخراساني الجويني الصوفي . ولد سنة 644

If i recall this guy believes in the Imamah actually so he is pure twelver Shiite NOT A SUNNI.

[TripolySunni]

Ok it's Official the Shiites Call him "Shaykh el Islam" HE CANNOT BE A NORMAL MUSLIM. They never call the scholars of ahel al Sunnah Shaykh el ISlam they usually call us Nasibis.

روي شيخ الإسلام الحموئي في فرائد السمطين

Search for it in this Shiite Link to verify:

http://www.maarefislam.org/doreholom...85%D8%A7%D9%86

He declares he is a Shiite at the beginning of his book:

في مقدمة كتابه بعد ذكر النبي (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) ما نصه:

( وانتجب له أمير المؤمنين عليا أخا وعونا وردءا وخليلا ورفيقا ووزيرا ، وصيره على أمر الدين والدنيا له مؤازرا . . . وأنزل في شأنه : { إنما وليكم الله ورسوله . . . } تعظيماً لشأنه . . . وصلى الله على محمد عبده ونبيه . . . وعلى إمام الأولياء وأولاده الأئمة الأصفياء الذين أذهب الله عنهم الرجس وطهرهم تطهيرا . . . والحمد لله الذي ختم النبوة والرسالة بمحمد المصطفى . . . وبدأ الولاية من أخيه وفرع صنو أبيه المنزل من موسى فضيلته النبوية منزلة هارون ، وصيه الرضى المرتضى علي ( عليه السلام ) باب مدينة العلم المخزون . . . وآزره بالأئمة المعصومين من ذريته أهل الهداية والتقوى . . . ثم ختم الولاية بنجله الصالح المهتدي الحجة القائم بالحق . . . "

I read that this guy's scholars were Al Hilli (665) and el Tusi (672) who were some of the most Anti-Muslim shiite scholars ever. In Fact This guy was a Shiite and His Student Al Dahabi Was a Sunni and he became a great scholar later.

This is what Al Dahabi thinks of his teacher:

قول الذهبي رحمه الله في الحمويني الذي نقله الزركلي في الأعلام 1/63 : (شيخ خراسان ، كان حاطب ليل - يعني في رواية الحديث - جمع أحاديث ثنائيات وثلاثيات ورباعيات من الاباطيل المكذوبة . وعلى يده أسلم غازان).

In brief Al Dahabi says that Kharasani is spreading fabricated lies.

That is enough.

Another guy is called:

الحافظ أبو عبد الله فخر الدين محمد بن يوسف بن محمد النوفلي القريشي الكنجي الشافعي

Al Hafez abu Abdullah Fakhr el Din mohamad Bin Youssef Bin Mohamad el Noofali el Kurayshi el Kanji al Shafi'i, He is also a Shiite and was killed in 658 because he was a Shiite.

they also use his narrations and Say that al Imam el Shafi'i said this and that....

[Al-Kurdi]

I think he is al Dahabi's Shiekh (one of his Teachers) and He wrote the book called Fara'ed el Samatayn, believe it or not He is a Shiite.

Cover of his Book here:

http://www.hajr-network.net/hajrvb/s...hp?p=406874137

He is not the Shafi'i that you know but the Shiites like to trick the sunni Laymen and tell them Imam el Shafi'i said this. His name is "Ibrahim bin mohammad bin Mo'ayyid Bin Abdullah bin Ali bin Mohammad el juwayni el Kharasani.

إبراهيم بن محمد بن المؤيد بن عبد الله بن علي بن محمد بن حمويه . الإمام الكبير المحدث ، شيخ المشايخ صدر الدين أبو المجامع الخراساني الجويني الصوفي . ولد سنة 644

If i recall this guy believes in the Imamah actually so he is pure twelver Shiite NOT A SUNNI.

!!! Excellent information!

However, I´d like some references on that point. A person who simply thinks that this Shaykh is a Shiite is not a real reference.

I want books, I want pages, I want authors, I want names! I´d deeply appreciate it if you could give me that. And no copy-pasting, the information is to be real!

and once again.

[Mubid al-Majus]

Questions that arise after reading this:

a) As I am not fond of the "Copy-Paste"-Culture, I´d be glad if any brother or sister could confirm these quoted Ahadith in the originial books and if there has ocurred any changings in wording or terminology.

b) If these Ahadith are in these books, are they deemed as Sahih by the majority of scholars?

c) If yes, then on what basis. If no, then what is the Daleel?

d) What is the interpretation of these Ahadith and what conclusions could be made by reading these Ahadith?

for eventual answers, honoured brothers and sisters.

Note: I want answers, not people expressing how much they hate the irrelevance of the Shiites, since I have had enough of that. Try to be as objective as possible in your reasoning.

Please, bestow me your ideas so that I could be better prepared when discussing with Shiites, since all my relatives are Shiites.

That is not Imam al-Haramayn `Abd al-Malik ibn `Abd Allah ibn Yusuf al-Juwayni (d. 478). The author of Fara’id al-Simtayn is Ibrahim ibn Muhammad ibn Himawayh al-Juwayni (d. 722).

The Fara’id that is in print is a pure Imami forgery. The narration you have quoted has individuals like al-Mufid, al-Saduq, in its chain. On top of that, it has several other flaws such as `Abd Allah ibn al-Hakam is unknown -- a fact even acknowledged by Shi`i scholars (al-Mufid min Mu`jam [332]). The text of the narration is also rejected for obvious reasons.

The conclusion is that it is a forgery and thus requires no interpretation.

What makes you think the majority of scholars will consider it sahih?

[Ahmad_shakeel]

jazakALLAH khair for making it clear for people like me

[Nomadic]

I remember a brother in the masjid discussing this with the imam of my local masjid. The imam said similar sentiment was also expressed regarding other sahaba (RAD). One can not simply quote few statment. This is what the some Shia do..
Many traditonal scholar including the deobandi scholars believes the khilafat have to be lead to an by the deserving Ahle Bayat. Ghazi Salahuddin Ayubi (Rad) tried to do this but with little or success.
A" knows best

[mohamedreza]

Sahih al-Bukhari Hadith: 9.329

Narrated Jabir Ibn Samura:

I heard the Prophet saying, "There will be twelve commanders (Amir)." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, the Prophet added, "All of them will be from Quraish."

The Prophet (PBUH&HF) said: "There shall be twelve Imams for this community, all of them from Quraish."

Reference: Musnad Ahmad Ibn Hanbal, v5, p106

Narrated Jabir Ibn Samura:

The Prophet (PBUH&HF) said: "The matter (life) will not end, until it is passed by twelve Caliphs." He then whispered a sentence. I asked my father what the Prophet said. He said, the Prophet added: "All of them will be from Quraish."

Sahih Muslim, Arabic version, Kitab al-Imaara, 1980 Edition Pub. in Saudi Arabia, v3, p1452, Tradition #5

These are the proofs, from your own sahih books, about Imammat.

Can any sunni brother please bring up a hadith showing the Holy Prophets endorsement of the caliphate?

Jazakallah

[Saad]

These are the proofs, from your own sahih books, about Imammat.

This hadith is a proof for Sunni and not Rawafid!

Hadith of the Twelve Caliphs [A Sunni Perspective]

http://www.ahlelbayt.com/articles/rebuttals/12-caliphs

[mohamedreza]

This hadith is a proof for Sunni and not Rawafid!

Hadith of the Twelve Caliphs [A Sunni Perspective]

http://www.ahlelbayt.com/articles/rebuttals/12-caliphs

I read the article. Apart from attacking the Shia beliefs, it could hardly deal with clarifying the hadith.

But it was interesting to see how the articles twisted things. From 4 rightly caliphs, as known, it talks about there being 6 rightly guided caliph, with 6 more to come. What determines a calliph according to you? What is the purpose of the hadith? All these questions remained unanswered.

If the Shia insist upon doing this, then let us point them to another twelve people mentioned in Sahih Muslim. The Prophet (صلّى الله عليه وآله وسلّم) said:

“In my Ummah, there would be twelve hypocrites and they would not be admitted to Paradise and they would not smell its odor, until the camel would pass through a needle’s hole.”

(Sahih Muslim, Book 38, Number 6689,

^^ From the article... Mashallah... does the one who wrote the article even know anything about who the 12 imams are, as he is calling them hypocrites?

Is he is implying that Ali, Hassan, Hussain, Zain-al Abedeen, Jaafer Sadiq and others from the ahlel bayt as hypocrites? What else can we expect from nawasibs