Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Imam Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

  1. #1
    Senior Member umar_italy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Location
    As the name suggests... :-)
    Posts
    4,100

    Default Imam Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?



    I remember having read that according to a deeper reading and understanding of al-Ghazali's works (and especially in his "Ihya `ulum ad-Din"), it emerges that he wasn't a proponent of permissibility of music.

    Could anyone direct me to some research about this topic?





  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Posts
    1,961

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    Quote Originally Posted by umar_italy View Post


    I remember having read that according to a deeper reading and understanding of al-Ghazali's works (and especially in his "Hiya ulum ad-Din"), it emerges that he wasn't a proponent of permissibility of music.

    Could anyone direct me to some research about this topic?





    Many years ago I remember myself reading this topoc in his famous book Ihya Ulumu'd-Din. As far as I remember, there he devides the legality of music into three categories: Haram, jaiz, mustahab (?). The best start would be looking into his Ihya and I think you can find it English version somewhere online. Once, you come up with conclusion, would you mind posting it here so that we can refresh our knowledge on that.

    Jzk


  3. #3
    Senior Member umar_italy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Location
    As the name suggests... :-)
    Posts
    4,100

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    Quote Originally Posted by verdana View Post


    Many years ago I remember myself reading this topoc in his famous book Ihya Ulumu'd-Din. As far as I remember, there he devides the legality of music into three categories: Haram, jaiz, mustahab (?). The best start would be looking into his Ihya and I think you can find it English version somewhere online. Once, you come up with conclusion, would you mind posting it here so that we can refresh our knowledge on that.

    Jzk


    brother.
    I do have a booklet in Italian with sections of the Ihya in which he talks about music, but what I was interested in reading is the research that some brother here had announced about this matter, saying the results are quite different from the common idea we laymen got about Imam Ghazali's stance.

    Anyone remembers?


  4. #4
    Senior Member umar_italy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Location
    As the name suggests... :-)
    Posts
    4,100

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?



    Done a little research and found the following:

    1.
    "1. Imam al-Ghazali's writings on this matter are usually misunderstood and/or misrepresented. Some time ago, I studied this great Imam's books to see what he has written on music and I wrote a long article (in Turkish) demonstrating that he (like other imams) considers music (with instruments) haram in general, allowed only in specific cases and then only with specific instruments (like "daf" in weddings or in battle to encourage the soldiers etc.)"
    [Murat Yazici - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post359755]

    2.
    "It is not permissible to use musical instruments when reciting salawats, takbeers, and other religious lyrics. Imam al-Ghazali rahimahullah, for example, states that "Praising the Prophet (sallallahu ta'ala alayhe wa sallam) is an ibada [ibadat, good deed done for Allahu ta'ala] and must not be done with an entertainment instrument like daf [a type of drum]." I translated this quote from Kimya-yi-Saadat, but a similar statement can be found in Ihya. Wassalam."
    [Murat Yazici - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post427177]

    3.
    "I have previously written the following:

    http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...l=1#post360273

    In Kimya (and with different wording in Ihya) Imam Ghazali rahimahullah states:

    "Praising the Prophet [sallallahu alayhe wa sallam] is an ibadat [good and serious deed]. It is not permissible to do so with daf which is an instrument of entertainment."

    Note that Imam Ghazali states that "daf" [duff/drum] is permitted under many conditions (in weddings, in Muslim festivals [ıyds], etc), but not when praising the Prophet. This is a very important point, one which seems to be ignored or overlooked by those who use Imam's writings to argue that music with instruments is allowed.

    A while ago, I have compiled the writings of Islamic scholars on this subject (in Turkish):

    http://muratyazici.blogspot.com/2008...edilir-mi.html

    It is proved here that intentional dancing and musical instruments are not allowed during dhikr.
    "
    [Murat Yazici - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post444124]

    4.
    "It is not permissible to use musical instruments when reciting salawats, takbeers, and other religious lyrics. Imam al-Ghazali rahimahullah, for example, states that "Praising the Prophet (sallallahu ta'ala alayhe wa sallam) is an ibada [ibadat, good deed done for Allahu ta'ala] and must not be done with an entertainment instrument like daf [duff/drum]." I translated this quote from Kimya-yi-Saadat ["It is in the chapter on "Sama' and Wajd," the second section." - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post444183], but a similar statement can be found in Ihya.

    Imam Rabbani rahimahullah states that this kind of practice (dancing, mixing music with religious actions etc) is absolutely prohibited and he uses some very strong words against those who practice it. cf. Maktubat, the final paragraphs of 266th letter.He cites the ayats [verses] from An'am (6/70) and A'raf (7/51) in this connection.
    "
    [Murat Yazici - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post444143]

    5a.
    "Brother Murat, you mentioned somewhere that Imam Ghazali's views on music are misrepresented by some people, and that his views conform with the majority of the scholars. Could you elaborate on this very briefly? - or in detail if you have time!"
    [SeekerOfGuidance - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post360261]
    5b.
    "Well, to be convincing, I would have to translate several passages from Ihya and Kimya and his other books. I might do that in the future, but I really do not have the time for that right now.

    But, let me (roughly) translate just three passages:

    "It is not permissible to enter the house of a person without his permission to investigate secret sins he commits behind closed and locked doors. But if the sounds of musical instruments and games are heard from outside, those who hear those sounds can enter the house and break the musical instruments."

    "Avoiding the manufacture of musical instruments and similar prohibited tools is [tantamount to] avoiding zulm [sin, cruelty]."

    These are from Ihya (second volume, pages 218 and 802 in the most widely available Turkish translation).

    In Kimya (and with different wording in Ihya) he states:

    "Praising the Prophet [sallallahu alayhe wa sallam] is an ibadat [good and serious deed]. It is not permissible to do so with daf which is an instrument of entertainment."

    Note that Imam Ghazali states that "daf" is permitted under many conditions (in weddings, in Muslim festivals [ıyds], etc), but not when praising the Prophet. This is a very important point, one which seems to be ignored or overlooked by those who use Imam's writings to argue that music with instruments is allowed.
    "
    [Murat Yazici - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post360273]
    5c.
    "I too heard the same from one of Shiekh Nuh's [Shaykh Nuh Ha Mim Keller] answering sessions. He doesn't expand much on it, but he does spare a mention or two about Imam Ghazali's stance, if i remember correctly. You can hear his answer to the questions from these recorded MP3's (I'm not sure in which part or when he mentions it, but he definitely mentions in one of the two) : Music Fiqh and Islam Part1 [http://www.shadhiliteachings.com/tar...wnload&file=77] & Music Fiqh and Islam Part2 [http://www.shadhiliteachings.com/tar...wnload&file=78]. Quite informative, nevertheless."
    [yas245 - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post443221]

    Ed ora una "consulenza" dal persiano:

    6a.
    "As one who knows Persian (the language in which the above tract was originally authored) and has a father that has thoroughly immersed himself in the works and teachings of Imam Ghazali, I can say that to translate what Imam Ghazali has called "Samaa" (i.e. devotional songs, odes, etc.) as "Music", is quite misleading.

    Furthermore, in his "Alchemy of Happiness" (pers. "Kemiya e Sa'aadat") he has written at length about the prohibition of nearly all musical instruments.

    You must understand when sharing something like this when you say "music", people do not restrict its definition to songs sung without musical instruments or merely with a "daff".

    Regardless, if someone does keep the above in mind and reads that extract from the "Alchemy of Happiness", they will learn much.
    "
    [Sunni_Student786 - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post179131]
    6b.
    "This is what I wondered too. When I read the forgoing discussion via another translation there was no mention of musical instruments. And all of a sudden we have people claiming that Hujjat ul Islam allowed musical instruments. Subhan Allah."
    [ahsanirfan - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post179134]

    E per chiudere:

    7.
    "Hakim al-Ummat Mawlana Thanvi [r.h] wrote Haq al Sama where he mentions that sama is prohibited according to all 4 Imams as mentioned by Imam Ghazali [r.h] in Ihya Uloom and other major books.

    Haq al-Sama (in urdu) http://www.4shared.com/file/16289438...ified=fa109d20
    ".
    [Saad - http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...=1#post289358]


  5. #5
    Senior Member Jahid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Sister
    Madhhab
    Maliki
    Location
    online
    Posts
    299

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    He (ra) clearly stated music haraam and doesn“t agree with salawat and dhikr in combination with it.

    I am not of much knowledge but this is a clear thing.

    May Allah have mercy on his soul.
    Practice what you preach, and preach what you practice!


  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    2,253

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    Assalamu aliakum,

    Imam Ghazzali did not even bring up the issue of music in much detail in his books. What he talks about is sama' which is along the lines of poetry without musical instruments. It is this sama' which he categorizes into impermissible, permissible and recommended. But from the few lines he does say about music it shows he is against it - for example he says that the earnings of a person who plays (or sells - I don't remember) musical instruments is haraam.


  7. #7
    Senior Member Jahid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Sister
    Madhhab
    Maliki
    Location
    online
    Posts
    299

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    Lets just hope nobody takes that as an excuse to declare those “head banging party“s to be halaal...
    Astaghfriullah
    Practice what you preach, and preach what you practice!


  8. #8
    Moderator Saad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Location
    Home
    Posts
    5,784

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    Assalam o alaykum,

    I would recommend Slippery Stone: An Inquiry into Islam's Stance on Music by Khalid Baig.

    Here are some scans from his book dealing with Imam Ghazali (may Allah have mercy on him) and music.








    Haq Char Yaar

    Barelwiyyat

    Ahlel Bayt

    Free Books



    Chand say Tashbih daina, yeh bhi koi Insaf hai
    Us kay Munh pay Chayan, Madani ka Chahra Saf hai


  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Gender
    Brother
    Madhhab
    Hanafi
    Location
    Toronto Canada
    Posts
    822

    Default Re: Al-Ghazali stance on music misunderstood?

    Quote Originally Posted by Saad View Post
    Assalam o alaykum,

    I would recommend Slippery Stone: An Inquiry into Islam's Stance on Music by Khalid Baig.

    this book looks very interestin...


Similar Threads

  1. Slippery Stone - An Inquiry into Islam's Stance On Music
    By Nu'ayman ibn Amr in forum Islamic Media Reviews
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 02-11-2008, 08:01 PM
  2. Imam Ghazali
    By ENIGMA in forum General Islam
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-08-2008, 09:26 AM
  3. Imam Ghazali allowed music?
    By The_Humble_One in forum General Islam
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10-01-2008, 08:01 PM
  4. Imam Ghazali
    By muslim forever in forum Inspirational Stories and History
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 16-12-2005, 08:37 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •