Men Scholars vs Women Scholars?

[Colonel_Hardstone]

Original questions are in a separate thread:

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...alima&p=452359

Appa,

You havn't answered the question anywhere:

Q1) Where is the Shariah permission for sending your daughter from Leicester to Dewsbury without Mahram?

Q2) Give us examples from Islamic history where girls used to go study over long distances and live there without Mahram?

Please don't try to be Barelwee by posing questions like, "Have you found something that prohibits it?"

We know very well what goes on in Girls Darul-uloom & Hostels, lets just leave it because this is an Islamic forum and not "The Daily Sun"

P.S: I said "in principle" girls staying long distances for Madrasah is the same as university, "in principle", "in principle" "in principle"

Lets continue with those queries in the other thread but here is Aapa's reply below needs some discusions:

I respectfully disagree brother. The traits of a good aalim are quite different from the traits of a good aalimah as they both fulfill different purposes and have very different roles.

Not being sarcastic but really...

I would really love to know the traits, purpose, roles of a Sister who is an Alimah?

And their acheivements in UK thus far?

[UmHasan]

Respected Brother,
I would dearly like to attempt to clear up a few misconceptions here so please bring this up again in a few days/weeks time.
At the moment I am still recovering my energies after the previous thread. You are a formiddable member to go head to head with.

[muminah]

Without taking any sides, I am looking forward to your response sister Soupy. I hope it will answer many questions I have in my head, and I may contribute to the thread if I have time after your response.

[ENIGMA]

Unfortunately,both alims and alimahs do not get utilised to their potential by their communities. Thats why so many gifted alims do not want to become Imams and set up their own learning academies. They are some really gifted and talented alims(and alimah I assume) who have got great ideas but out guji communities are so set in their ways, the alims get frustrated. Also dealing with committee members turns alot of alims off the Imam role. they find it much better to start their own learning academies because they are not straight jacketed by the committee's red tape.

[ENIGMA]

Without taking any sides, I am looking forward to your response sister Soupy. I hope it will answer many questions I have in my head, and I may contribute to the thread if I have time after your response.

personal question:

did mufti shabbir(bury DU) give you encouragement and permission to go to uni?

[VeiledOne]

how long is the alimah course for women in uk? how is it different then the alim course? I know this varies from place to place.

[UmHasan]

Not being sarcastic but really...

I would really love to know the traits, purpose, roles of a Sister who is an Alimah?

And their acheivements in UK thus far?

Two thing first, please....

(1) What would be the point of this discussion? Would it be to make further suggestions to encourage, inspire and motivate them into doing more? Or is it an opportunity to criticize, condemn and belittle the sisters in questions? Lets set the tone first please.

(2) Will the responses be based on actual experiences and observations of aalimahs and will any aalimahs or graduates from madrasah be actually contributing to this thread?

[happinessx100]

bump.... anyone?
Colonel, Soupy, Enigma, Muminah, Verdana, Veiled one, Fake Shaykh...????

[muminah]

Two thing first, please....

(1) What would be the point of this discussion? Would it be to make further suggestions to encourage, inspire and motivate them into doing more? Or is it an opportunity to criticize, condemn and belittle the sisters in questions? Lets set the tone first please.

(2) Will the responses be based on actual experiences and observations of aalimahs and will any aalimahs or graduates from madrasah be actually contributing to this thread?

1) I think the tone should of course be of encouragement, inspiration etc, but that can only be done with constructive criticism. There is a need for reformation of the aalim course, and in my opinion especially the sister's aalima courses. There is a need for a major review, but it seems people are not willing to bring the issues to light and solve them as the senior managment seem to want to keep everything in a hush and are not willing to positive change.

2) Well I don't see why aalimas like yourself can't contribute. This is an open forum to all.

[UmHasan]

1) I think the tone should of course be of encouragement, inspiration etc, but that can only be done with constructive criticism. There is a need for reformation of the aalim course, and in my opinion especially the sister's aalima courses. There is a need for a major review, but it seems people are not willing to bring the issues to light and solve them as the senior managment seem to want to keep everything in a hush and are not willing to positive change.
2) Well I don't see why aalimas like yourself can't contribute. This is an open forum to all.

Ah well, most of the times in discussions like this only one side of the argument is put forward. Criticism is fine if it is constructive, but often it’s not. Just complaining and pouring the blame on to the ulamah for everything that is wrong with society. But here goes...

I would really love to know the traits, purpose, roles of a Sister who is an Alimah?
And their achievements in UK thus far?

I am pressed for time at the moment, but in my opinion (which is my own, and not an answer on behalf of an institute or fraternity of aalimahs), graduates from a Madrasah are not aalimahs and do not consider themselves to be aalimahs. It is a label that has been devised by the masses who have little understanding of what is actually taught in a girls Madrasah, their purpose for attending and their expected contribution to society upon graduation.

Upon leaving Madrasah, they do not become scholars (actually I detest the word scholar/ aalimah being attributed to me, as I know it carries connotations that I am unable to fulfil) rather it is the effect of spending the years of owns youth in an environment of dars and tadrees that benefits a person. For many it is a time when hopes, inspiration and ambitions are shaped and sets the tone for future decisions in life. The positive influence of Quran and hadeeth help to focus these ambitions towards nobler goals.

It is unfortunate that upon leaving many graduates find that there are no provisions for them to engage with the public and being a young, inexperienced woman, restricted by her values of purdah, she cannot go out there herself to set up provision. Personally, I think it is not even her job to do so. It falls to the more experienced ulamah, the committees of masjids, the conscious, concerned experienced members of the public to arrange programmes, classes, seminars etc and then ask the graduate sisters to participate.

To expect these young girls to go out and change the state of Muslim women is wishful thinking. She still needs to learn how to cook, clean and run a home. She still needs to study further to prepare herself for the outside world and soon she will need to marry. After that, how can she find time to devote hours and hours of her time to spreading deen when there are kids to look after, homes to make and husbands to please? At that time, a few hours a day every evening is often the only khidmah she can realistically offer.

I have loads more to say, but also have a family to feed and a home to run. Please respond, and I will continue.