Modern day Secular Salaafism is another face of Secularism and inevitable aithism

[umar_italy]

Brother Nomadic may be a bit too much harsh and generalizing with the salafies, but he has some good points indeed.

The mindset of many Salafis is actually devoid of any spirituality and it's very "rational" and "modern" (just take a look at their over-reliance of modern science and "scientific miracles of the Qur'an", their huge thirst for "modernity" and modern western stuff and accessories - whoever know some will understand what I mean), and their version of Islam in the end is quite compatible with secularism, although it may seems the opposite.

I find "salafism" and secularism in the Islamic worlds two sides of the same coin.
Orthodox "traditional" (not a-la-traditionalists, anyway) Islam is something else.

[London786]

dear brother umar don't you think the so-called traditionalists also fall into this category. I mean they make excuses for not implementing hudood, claim that democracy is compatiable or even encouraged by islam, hijab, niqab, defensive and offensive jihad, claim muslims can fight in armies that attack muslims, minority fiqh, music, watering down sunnah and saying its a custom, classifying all customs and traditions as bidah hasanah, apostacy...anything that the kuffar object to they water down.

So we are left with very little deen.

[umar_italy]

dear brother umar don't you think the so-called traditionalists also fall into this category. I mean they make excuses for not implementing hudood, claim that democracy is compatiable or even encouraged by islam, hijab, niqab, defensive and offensive jihad, claim muslims can fight in armies that attack muslims, minority fiqh, music, watering down sunnah and saying its a custom, classifying all customs and traditions as bidah hasanah, apostacy...anything that the kuffar object to they water down.

So we are left with very little deen.

Absolutely agreed, in fact, I find them to be worse than Salafies in most of the aspects.

I didn't intend to defend those people as reaction, it was just some pseudo-sociological annotation..

[sawaaiq]

Brother Nomadic may be a bit too much harsh and generalizing with the salafies, but he has some good points indeed.

What are his good points, especially when he talks about "Salafi secularism!", then turns around and uses the arguments of the secularists against the Salafis and accuses them of being backwards?!

The mindset of many Salafis is actually devoid of any spirituality

This is a popular "traditionalist" accusation against the Salafis. While some Salafis might be like this, many are not and many concentrate and speak about zuhd and tazkiyyat an-nafs(something Sufis don't have a monopoly on) and there are many Salafi shuyookh like this such as Sulaymaan al-Ulayt, Usama Abd al-Adheem, Muhammad Hassan, Mahmood al-Masri, Muhammad Husayn Ya'qoub and others.

Lectures and khutbahs of Salafi shuyookh on zuhd and tazkiyyat an-nafs:

http://www.islamway.com/?iw_s=Lesson...category_id=34

and it's very "rational" and "modern" (just take a look at their over-reliance of modern science and "scientific miracles of the Qur'an", their huge thirst for "modernity" and modern western stuff and accessories - whoever know some will understand what I mean),

As opposed to Sufi shuyookh like Ali Jum'ah who says liberalism is compatible with Islaam or Ahmad Hassoun who says the same thing about secularism?

and their version of Islam in the end is quite compatible with secularism, although it may seems the opposite.

I find "salafism" and secularism in the Islamic worlds two sides of the same coin.
Orthodox "traditional" (not a-la-traditionalists, anyway) Islam is something else.

Then why are Salafi shuyookh at the forefront of confronting secularism in the Arab world?

dear brother umar don't you think the so-called traditionalists also fall into this category. I mean they make excuses for not implementing hudood, claim that democracy is compatiable or even encouraged by islam, hijab, niqab, defensive and offensive jihad, claim muslims can fight in armies that attack muslims, minority fiqh, music, watering down sunnah and saying its a custom, classifying all customs and traditions as bidah hasanah, apostacy...anything that the kuffar object to they water down.

There is no doubt that there are way more "traditionalists" who are watering down the deen then Salafis and when you have Salafi shuyookh like Yusuf Juday' expressing modernist opinions, they are refuted by other Salafi shuyookh.