Evolution Theory as a Powerful Weapon?

[Abu Zakir]

The government when it is big and involved in every little detail of individuals economic lives, taxing them, printing money and increasing its supply, buying products from private companies it creates inefficient firms protected from competition, I think David Rockefella of Standard Oil is quoted to have said 'Competition is a Sin', and this illustrates for me how badly we are all being shafted by corporations, and Atheists like Dawkins and others defend this status quo, it is no wonder that he is paid and given publicity by companies like Microsoft. Atheists like Dawkins are a disgrace and any atheists who admire him as a champion of atheist science are also to be considered disgraceful and ethically challenged.

Obviously? Why is this obvious? And again: what does this have to do with you claim that




Are you saying that the government is subsidising every industry? The government also buys desks. Does it thus subsidise the "desk building" industry? You have made some claims and so far are unable to qualify why, how and what these claims are based on.



What is this supposed to mean? Is this clip from some Catholic institution relevant to anything? A paper by someone who claims his god creates all humans and this means evolution and speciation are impossible and which slanders anyone who accepts the fact of evolution and especially Richard Dawkins is relevant to you?



It seems I am too much based in reality. I don't see anything on "Social Darwinism" here.

Could you define what "Social Darwinism" means for you?
Ah, but you are unable to answer questions. Oh dear!

[malone]

ah @ dishonesty. There is an edit function appearing below every post which i have used. The edit time is mentioned there as well so lets not try to play the "victim card". The absence rabbit fossils in the cambrian explosion can be explained by some other factors and the tautology of theory of evolution can never be hidden with such examples. Come up with a single falsification rule intrinsic to the theory of evolution. Once i asked another "atheist expert on the theory of evolution" the same question and after three days he came up with the soring response "If there were no genes , the theory of evolution would have been false" and i think your mate stopS is trying to say the same thing but in his sheer ignorance he has called it "Non genetic combination". Don't pass judgments by repeating the most repeated atheist cliches " The difference is that in science IF someone found....." You don't have any monopoly over the sciences and science is not a monolithic tradition so that you can enjoy the liberty of writing such ridiculous statements.

What is this tautology? You keep mentioning it but it would help if you stated what this tautology is supposed to be.

And I love the way you quickly shift the focus on to me by calling me a victim when really it was you with your 'background' in the subject that knows so much about evolution got fooled so easily by such a childish prank. Then, when the prank is made clear, you say that evidence you gave never mattered in the first place!! Of course the absence can be explained by other factors there are alternative explanations for EVERYTHING but the likelihood AT THE PRESENT TIME is that they are not there, nor indeed ANY MODERN ANIMAL is there becuase they DIDNT EXIST IN THE PRE CAMBRIAN ERA. If one is found, or even the part of one, then SCIENCE will be humble enough to change their ideas, but you? You are not humble enough to change any idea no matter what the evidence. And this is not a ridiculous statement, but is usually the way science work - sometimes ideas that were believed for 100s of years were discarded when the evidence came up with better explanations.

[malone]

StopS you are a low yield crop. Even Richard Dawkins would have been a Muslim by now.
And we have other plans too. We shall chase Dawkins into a corner. He has been fooling with Christians. The party is over and now the time is up for him to look for a cover. We Muslims have arrived, by the Desire of Lord Most High.

This is only empty rhetoric born of belief, not evidence. Empty words.

Coming back to biology major. If you claim that you know better than a biology major then the onus is on you to substantiate it. If I were you I shall not give it a try.

From a biology major who doesn't even know enough to check his sources even when they are most obvious prank. I thin we can all do better than such one who just believes what he wants and doesn't critique or question his sources or beliefs at all.

[faizol]

bla bla bla..

why don't you provide explanation first about how to use photons meter to measure events outside of the time-space fabric like you claimed in the other thread? Tell us all how to use the cheapo detector from alibaba.com to measure events before the big bang? Don't tell me you gonna provide the measurements of photons amount in a cubic metre at T temperature for that (like, also how you "explained" in the other thread)?

[faizol]

This is only empty rhetoric born of belief, not evidence. Empty words.



From a biology major who doesn't even know enough to check his sources even when they are most obvious prank. I thin we can all do better than such one who just believes what he wants and doesn't critique or question his sources or beliefs at all.

so you gonna be screaming around the world and shouting for eternity that my brother in Islam dr.ati made a mistake (of which he admitted to it) about his evidence and won't let it go to focus on the actual biology discussion if he wants to properly continue it?

[Saqqib_Ali]

Bill gates doesn't give millions....he gives billions...it is a fact, if this is marketing let it be so. If people didn't know they would say oh this rich man is heartless, doesnt give the poor their due, as a matter of fact he's giving more than the islamically prescribed 2.5 percent.

Secondly, I'm not sure why it is hard to grasp that evolution is a fact, even accepted by many Christians. It is only some Christians on the fringe that try to prove that Adam (A.S) appeared out of no where like a magic trick. Allah in the Quran says Adam came from earth and water. This is what evolution says. That life came from the dead earth. And about the millions of years, would they appear million to Allah, I doubt it.

I think some people showing gaulability and in the same instance showing up Muslims to be backward/Uneducated fools. Wasn't it the great bin baaz who passed a fatwa saying that according to his understanding of the quran and sun ah the world was FLAT. And he is/was one of the great scholars of the Salafi movements.

Saying evolution is false is just like saying the Earth is Flat. Quran wasn't meant to be a scientific book rather a spiritual book guidance for all mankind. Science changes, Quran doesn't.

Salam

Saqqib

[Abu Zakir]

Bill Gates received Billions from the State monopoly which helped him. People who give charity and trumpet their philanthropy either have a guilty conscience or are promoting their self, and if their charity is conditional it is not charity. For example when the American government 'gives aid' to another government it might say we will give x amount of dollars but you must buy y amount of produce from us in return, and you will allow American companies to do this or that in your country. This is not charity it is seeking control disguised as trade.

Evolution is a fact? So apes turned into humans and this is incontestable? So Adam was not the first man he one day emerged as a man only after his ancestor apes had evolved? How common are random mutations, are they mostly beneficial and how much time would be needed for them to create the diverse life forms that we observe?

The early earth was a rock with no atmosphere, yet it rained...this allowed plants to grow and form an atmosphere? These days we have scientists who say that deforestation cause soil erosion, when it rains the water washes away all the soil which the roots of the trees used to hold together. This would then prevent any plants from gaining root where the soil is always being washed away by rain...in the early earth how did plants gain root without being washed away by rain? Obviously trees were little seedlings before they become giant trees?

Should we also accept that Bill Gates and his company deserve to be at the top because they are genetically superior to the rest of us? That they did not get to the top through government handouts, welfare and protection against competition?

Bill gates doesn't give millions....he gives billions...it is a fact, if this is marketing let it be so. If people didn't know they would say oh this rich man is heartless, doesnt give the poor their due, as a matter of fact he's giving more than the islamically prescribed 2.5 percent.

Secondly, I'm not sure why it is hard to grasp that evolution is a fact, even accepted by many Christians. It is only some Christians on the fringe that try to prove that Adam (A.S) appeared out of no where like a magic trick. Allah in the Quran says Adam came from earth and water. This is what evolution says. That life came from the dead earth. And about the millions of years, would they appear million to Allah, I doubt it.

I think some people showing gaulability and in the same instance showing up Muslims to be backward/Uneducated fools. Wasn't it the great bin baaz who passed a fatwa saying that according to his understanding of the quran and sun ah the world was FLAT. And he is/was one of the great scholars of the Salafi movements.

Saying evolution is false is just like saying the Earth is Flat. Quran wasn't meant to be a scientific book rather a spiritual book guidance for all mankind. Science changes, Quran doesn't.

Salam

Saqqib

[Saqqib_Ali]

The questions you ask show you don't actually understand the issues you're talking about, but briefly:

We did not as a species emerge from modern day monkeys rather other "species" we might best describe as monkeys. So monkeys and us came from the same route, but our englightened selves is maybe what is meant by breathing soul into us. Imagine th favour on us, just because of the ruh we are what we are, what you and me would call human. otherwise we are just animals. Allah also says in the Quran some people who disobeyed were turned into monkeys, well this was done maybe by removing this aspect from them, Allah knows best.

Allah created life from lifeless Earth, and this is what evolution teaches, that life came from lifeless matter. Evolution says that over million of years etc... But this is in our refence of time, would it be the same length of time in Allahs time reference (hint:he is out side this thing called time).

So conclusion:Islam isn't at odds with evolution, and we shouldnt support the drivel that comes out of the mouth of some Christians.

Finally, Bill Gates et al. Me personally in the UK only heard about his charity when he first started his charity and because of what was happening, the media took great interest as Bill Gates was one of those personalities famous as the richest man in the world, and if such man starts to give his money away, that would be of great interest. but since then in the Uak I've hardly heard anything at all, I know he's funding things in Africa, something even to do with AIDs etc... But without researching I don't know so at the most his marketing failed.

About backing of Microsoft etc... Well these are just conspiracy theories which people love to believe the fact is that the true nature of what happened could be seen from modern day Facebook, Google, ayoutube, Amazon, twitter, etc... Are these also backed by the US government in a unfair way?

What happened was the company that clicked best with the consumer was the most successful and drove others out of the market. Remember quick books, Netscape Navigator etc...

Ever heard of Bing? Which is more popular Google or Bing? But how, Microsoft is favoured by the government isn't it?
Apple and Microsoft are competitors and after many decades Apple from a company ready to go bankrupt has gone on to become the largest corporate, even bigger than Microsoft, so what happened to the governments favourite? As far as I know, the US administration don't buy Apple products, rather Obama is known for his Blackberry.

Salam

About

[suleimanibnsalim]

What is this tautology? You keep mentioning it but it would help if you stated what this tautology is supposed to be.

And I love the way you quickly shift the focus on to me by calling me a victim when really it was you with your 'background' in the subject that knows so much about evolution got fooled so easily by such a childish prank. Then, when the prank is made clear, you say that evidence you gave never mattered in the first place!! Of course the absence can be explained by other factors there are alternative explanations for EVERYTHING but the likelihood AT THE PRESENT TIME is that they are not there, nor indeed ANY MODERN ANIMAL is there becuase they DIDNT EXIST IN THE PRE CAMBRIAN ERA. If one is found, or even the part of one, then SCIENCE will be humble enough to change their ideas, but you? You are not humble enough to change any idea no matter what the evidence. And this is not a ridiculous statement, but is usually the way science work - sometimes ideas that were believed for 100s of years were discarded when the evidence came up with better explanations.

The point is, we're dealing in probablilities. There is a probability that evolution did not take place exactly and precisely as certain proponents of the theory claim. Of course, you could assert - and it is asserted currently - that certain models present the most likely sequence of events, but that would be within a worldview where the potential existance of a God is not even entertained; I don't blame scientists, philosophy is not their field. However, we as Muslims will continue to interpret evidence under a paradigm where Allah does indeed exist. Hope you understand... I'm not looking for an argument.

was-salam

[Maripat]

This is only empty rhetoric born of belief, not evidence. Empty words.

From a biology major who doesn't even know enough to check his sources even when they are most obvious prank. I thin we can all do better than such one who just believes what he wants and doesn't critique or question his sources or beliefs at all.

I was talking to StopS. He is intelligent, energetic and irreverent. You have only one third of that. And neither you nor StopS stand a chance when it comes to Dr Ati. Being a sinner I do deserve all the insults that come my way but please release all the air you want to release and be done with it. I am completely interested in Dr Ati-StopS conversation. I do not enjoy unnecessary conversation with non-mahram. Kindly be on your way leave me to mine.